Date:         Sat, 5 Jan 2002 21:26:09 -0800
Reply-To:     Steve Sullivan <steveis@SPEAKEASY.ORG>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Steve Sullivan <steveis@SPEAKEASY.ORG>
Subject:      A Snow Story (Whoa-vanagon!!!) and Lessons Learned
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Once Upon a Time, just last week. . . .

. . . Two friends went snow camping north of Whistler, BC. With his fairly
new Michelin Agilis tires (Mud and Snow rated) our hero felt confident
driving the snowy road, though getting stuck twice on nearly flat parking
lots made him wonder. Wasn't his Westy supposed to be superior in snow and
ice because all the weight is over the drive axle?

Then came New Years Day, almost their last.

They were slowly coming down the steep 11% grade of the road to Lilloolet
when, starting to round a hairpin curve, the van suddenly started sliding
sideways! He hadn't even touched the brakes, had he?

Before our hero could do anything the van was at the point of no return,
where the engine's weight would pull the van completely around and they'd
spin out of control (at a sedate 10 mph) toward either the concrete barrier
or a deep ditch!

Now our intrepid driver is quite experienced in snow and ice: he dumped the
clutch, frantically steered into the slide, and threw liberal curses all
around. But it looked to him that it was way too late.

Just what miracle of conditions or intervention or curses caused the wheels
to grip enough to make the corner can only be speculated. But now our
normally sanguine hero was slightly nervous and braked (slid) enough to stab
the transmission into first.

"We'll go down nice and slow and in control now," he thought.

He thought wrong.

Now next to a sheer drop-off hundreds of feet down on one side with no guard
rail, and the deep ditch on the other, the van started sliding straight down
the hill. What the?!? Must be so slippery that the back pressure caused by
engine compression is causing the tires to lose their grip. Hmmm. Never had
that happen. Darn.

At this point, the van, and the two friends, are sliding straight down an
11% grade. Can't slow down using the engine. Can't slow down using the
brakes. Can't slow down. In fact, this is the first time our hero had seen
the speedometer go over 20 mph (and rising) in first gear!

Oh, and that ditch and the sheer cliff are still there and another hairpin
curve is only a hundred feet ahead. . .

"An interesting mental exercise," he thought, "but I've got to do something.
And now."

Pumping the brakes actually worked enough to get around the hairpin, and the
next, and the next, and all the way to the bottom of the hill.

"Whew," he thought.

"Whew," his friend thought.

"Whew," anyone still reading this thought.

And the moral of this story is. . .


1) Though the Michelin Agilis is the only tire with a high enough weight and
inflation rating for the heavy Westy, and though it's rated as a Mud and
Snow tire, it works like Shinola in any snowy, icy, or slick situation
(except rain, where they excel).

2) Hills with any amount of snow or ice? Always chain up!! I didn't even
tell the story of what happened later, and the chaining up saga. The
conditions were no problem for any other car, even with all-season tires
only. The weight of the vanagon requires too much power to pull up hills,
causing the drive wheels to lose traction, or to need more braking effort
which is more likely to cause a loss of traction.

3) Be aware that if your rear starts sliding sideways (ahem, the van's), the
greater weight back there will cause you to lose control and spin far, far
faster than in any other front-engined rear wheel drive vehicle. Drive
appropriately and if in doubt, whip it out (the chains).

4) Remember, the speedometer connects to the front wheel (left) and if it
dips suddenly it means your front wheels are locked up (you're braking too
much). The tachometer connects to the rear wheels (drive train) and if it
dips it means your rear wheels are locked up (too much braking again), or if
it jumps wildly up, you're spinning your wheels (too much power).

5) Be careful. Slide into the ditch (or another car) and bend the unibody on
a vanagon and I'll bet the repairs are so expensive your insurance will
probably just total the van and you'll lose your beloved.

Maybe now it's time to buy 15" wheels so I can put some REAL snow tires on
this thang. How about it, how does the vanagoingsideways handle with snow
tires? Better? Reports from those with experience welcomed. I've never had
trouble like this in any other vehicle I've driven, so it was a surprise to
say the least.

Steve

Calvin, the slippery 1984 Westy
Hobbes, the imaginary Westy Syncro