Date:         Sun, 6 Jan 2002 23:29:53 -0800
Reply-To:     Wayne Hagan <waynehagan@MAC.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Wayne Hagan <waynehagan@MAC.COM>
Subject:      The van in snow
In-Reply-To:  <F140rwvKYsPZOAPicjJ0001a37b@hotmail.com>
Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

I have a '91 Syncro Westy, you know, 5500 lbs., rear differential lock,
Goodrich AT tires, good traction stuff. This bus has demonstrated amazing
traction, the only vehicle moving on our street in a record storm 4 years
ago, pulling a band new 4-runner out of a snow bank that I had no problem
with, etc... except one thing... IMHO all vans suck compared to cars in
directional stability. If the van gets into tail spinning on ice, kiss it
good bye. I would take my Audi or Jetta any day running at highway speeds
over black ice, the van will tail spin and roll way before a car will. A
fellow Auto Designer at work explained it this way, what's going to fly
better through the air, (aerodynamics aside) an arrow or a brick?
Interestingly enough, he brought this up because he was test driving a Jetta
over a Fox and liked the Fox better for it's directional stability (i.e.
center of gravity more forward). Personally I never heard anyone talk about
directional stability this way. My coveted Syncro when it hit a small patch
of ice at slow speed started a tail spin in a gradual turn that my car never
did. Traction (studs are the only way to really deal with ice) and power
take a back seat to momentum and center of gravity on highly slippery
surfaces or high speeds on moderately slippery surfaces. Think of it this
way, all those studies about roll overs in SUV's, its all about the basic
physics of lever arms and coefficients of friction and centers of gravity
(politics aside). A car going into a tail spin is essentially very like a
sideways rollover when ice is involved (actually hydroplaning at this time)
because the same forces come into effect. Yak Yak Yak.... my second rant
FWIW. Some of you science oriented folks help me out here.