Date:         Mon, 29 Apr 2002 16:47:04 -0700
Reply-To:     mike <mwmiller@CWNET.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         mike <mwmiller@CWNET.COM>
Subject:      FW: New engine
In-Reply-To:  <B8F32968.175E%mwmiller@cwnet.com>
Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

------ Forwarded Message
From: mike <mwmiller@cwnet.com>
Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2002 16:46:32 -0700
To: Stan Wilder <wilden1@juno.com>
Subject: Re: New engine

Yeah, I  read it, and I think he's correct.  Been my experience at least.
But this engine should have it's rings seated by 1000, at least according to
AVP and my mechanic friend.

Anyone have a different experience?

Mike

> From: Stan Wilder <wilden1@juno.com>
> Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2002 18:19:14 -0500
> To: mwmiller@CWNET.COM
> Subject: Re: New engine
>
> I believe I'll go to synthetic oil at the 1000 mile oil change and valve
> adjust.
> ---------------------
> Hey !-------- read this from Frank Grunthaner
> ---------------------
> Ahem! There is no reason to invoke superstition or animal sacrifice (i.e.
> belief) to explain or interpret well understood technical processes. The
> break-in process involves bringing the surface finish of the cylinder
> walls
> and the piston rings to a compatible level (RMS roughness modulated by
> differences in the Young's Modulus for the two or more different
> materials).
> This is accomplished in three generic ways:
>
> 1). Add an abrasive (Al2O3, SiC, aluminosilicates, particulate carbon
> etc.),
> mix with good dispersing lubricant and polish away. Works poorly with
> modern
> engines and neanderthal consumers.
>
> 2). Assemble the engine, provide a lubricant with adequate or marginal
> film
> strength properties, but with extensive dispersant additives. Run engine
> for
> break-in time. Variable speeds and load conditions are needed to get the
> broadest surface finish match between ring and cylinder wall. Here, low
> film
> strength oils are by definition paraffin or natural stock based. True
> break-in oils have very poor film strength and are heavily sulfurated for
> good capture of microparticles. These microparticle suspensions can lead
> to
> extensive wear if the lubricant is not changed out in time.
>
> 3). Using current (read here expensive) machining and polishing
> techniques,
> prepare the cylinder bore so that at the end of machining (multiple
> rebore,
> reaming and polishing, followed by anneal and polish) the ring and wall
> combination are as well matched as would be achieved after optimal
> versions
> of step 2. Higher ticket, low volume manufacturers (Porsche, Lexus,
> others)
> use this approach and can afford to deliver their product with high film
> strength oils (read synthetic here) and forgo the break-in ritual.
>
> So ---- use synthetics from the start in a mass market vehicle (VW, Audi,
> etc) and the surfaces will mate in 4 to 15 times the net piston surface
> lapping (translates as 4 to 15 times more miles for break-in with
> synthetic
> oil vs. natural stocks). Use synthetics to break-in a remanufactured
> block
> from a rebuilder - we could go to Europa and Titan and return before ....
>
> No myth, no legend, just engineering, tribology and materials science.
> After
> all we are in the 21st century!
>
> Frank Grunthaner
> On Mon, 29 Apr 2002 15:26:50 -0700 mike <mwmiller@CWNET.COM> writes:
>> Vanites,
>>
>> The new engine is in, running and has been actually driven [8
>> miles].  It's
>> an AVP 2.1 with 1.9 FI and ignition.
>>
>> Smells funny, shifts oddly [all the shifter bushings and plastic
>> parts have
>> been replaced.  I'll be driving as much as possible to break it in
>> prior to
>> leaving for my cross country.
>>
>> Thanks to all with their suggestions for stuff to take, I'm
>> assembling it
>> now.  Hope I don't overload the van, not too much as least.  I'll be
>> keeping
>> track of the mileage, oil usage etc. and will post that if anyone
>> is
>> interested.  I believe I'll go to synthetic oil at the 1000 mile oil
>> change
>> and valve adjust.
>>
>> Wish me luck.
>>
>> Mike
>>
>
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