Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2002 17:20:01 -0700
Reply-To: mike <mwmiller@CWNET.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: mike <mwmiller@CWNET.COM>
Subject: Re: New engine
In-Reply-To: <20020429.185537.-272687.1.wilden1@juno.com>
Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
That compression check is a good idea. I'll do that. I think 145 is pretty
good but I'll check Bentley. I
Thanks,
> From: Stan Wilder <wilden1@juno.com>
> Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2002 18:55:37 -0500
> To: mwmiller@cwnet.com
> Subject: Re: New engine
>
> I've got 7000 miles on my Air Cooled 2000cc and I'm still getting that
> metallic looking oil from my filter.
> You know metallic like womens nail polish.
> That tells me the rings are still busy eating the cylinder walls. I cut
> the oil from the filter 50/50 with gasoline and get a better look at it.
> I'm probably going to hold off till 10000 to make the change.
> Waser boxers may have steel cylinders instead of cast iron and your
> mechanic friend could be right but Frank was addressing Waser Boxers in
> his reply.
> You can't hurt anything because you can always flush the engine and go
> back.
> I'd check the compression and see if its up where you want it and that
> should tell you.
> I've not checked my compression on my engine but I'm told if I've got
> 135/140 Psi then thats as good as its going to get on an Air Cooled but
> with Waser Boxers I think it might be more.
>
> Stan
> On Mon, 29 Apr 2002 16:46:32 -0700 mike <mwmiller@cwnet.com> writes:
>> Yeah, I read it, and I think he's correct. Been my experience at
>> least.
>> But this engine should have it's rings seated by 1000, at least
>> according to
>> AVP and my mechanic friend.
>>
>> Anyone have a different experience?
>>
>> Mike
>>
>>> From: Stan Wilder <wilden1@juno.com>
>>> Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2002 18:19:14 -0500
>>> To: mwmiller@CWNET.COM
>>> Subject: Re: New engine
>>>
>>> I believe I'll go to synthetic oil at the 1000 mile oil change and
>> valve
>>> adjust.
>>> ---------------------
>>> Hey !-------- read this from Frank Grunthaner
>>> ---------------------
>>> Ahem! There is no reason to invoke superstition or animal
>> sacrifice (i.e.
>>> belief) to explain or interpret well understood technical
>> processes. The
>>> break-in process involves bringing the surface finish of the
>> cylinder
>>> walls
>>> and the piston rings to a compatible level (RMS roughness
>> modulated by
>>> differences in the Young's Modulus for the two or more different
>>> materials).
>>> This is accomplished in three generic ways:
>>>
>>> 1). Add an abrasive (Al2O3, SiC, aluminosilicates, particulate
>> carbon
>>> etc.),
>>> mix with good dispersing lubricant and polish away. Works poorly
>> with
>>> modern
>>> engines and neanderthal consumers.
>>>
>>> 2). Assemble the engine, provide a lubricant with adequate or
>> marginal
>>> film
>>> strength properties, but with extensive dispersant additives. Run
>> engine
>>> for
>>> break-in time. Variable speeds and load conditions are needed to
>> get the
>>> broadest surface finish match between ring and cylinder wall.
>> Here, low
>>> film
>>> strength oils are by definition paraffin or natural stock based.
>> True
>>> break-in oils have very poor film strength and are heavily
>> sulfurated for
>>> good capture of microparticles. These microparticle suspensions
>> can lead
>>> to
>>> extensive wear if the lubricant is not changed out in time.
>>>
>>> 3). Using current (read here expensive) machining and polishing
>>> techniques,
>>> prepare the cylinder bore so that at the end of machining
>> (multiple
>>> rebore,
>>> reaming and polishing, followed by anneal and polish) the ring and
>> wall
>>> combination are as well matched as would be achieved after
>> optimal
>>> versions
>>> of step 2. Higher ticket, low volume manufacturers (Porsche,
>> Lexus,
>>> others)
>>> use this approach and can afford to deliver their product with
>> high film
>>> strength oils (read synthetic here) and forgo the break-in
>> ritual.
>>>
>>> So ---- use synthetics from the start in a mass market vehicle
>> (VW, Audi,
>>> etc) and the surfaces will mate in 4 to 15 times the net piston
>> surface
>>> lapping (translates as 4 to 15 times more miles for break-in with
>>> synthetic
>>> oil vs. natural stocks). Use synthetics to break-in a
>> remanufactured
>>> block
>>> from a rebuilder - we could go to Europa and Titan and return
>> before ....
>>>
>>> No myth, no legend, just engineering, tribology and materials
>> science.
>>> After
>>> all we are in the 21st century!
>>>
>>> Frank Grunthaner
>>> On Mon, 29 Apr 2002 15:26:50 -0700 mike <mwmiller@CWNET.COM>
>> writes:
>>>> Vanites,
>>>>
>>>> The new engine is in, running and has been actually driven [8
>>>> miles]. It's
>>>> an AVP 2.1 with 1.9 FI and ignition.
>>>>
>>>> Smells funny, shifts oddly [all the shifter bushings and plastic
>>>> parts have
>>>> been replaced. I'll be driving as much as possible to break it
>> in
>>>> prior to
>>>> leaving for my cross country.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks to all with their suggestions for stuff to take, I'm
>>>> assembling it
>>>> now. Hope I don't overload the van, not too much as least. I'll
>> be
>>>> keeping
>>>> track of the mileage, oil usage etc. and will post that if
>> anyone
>>>> is
>>>> interested. I believe I'll go to synthetic oil at the 1000 mile
>> oil
>>>> change
>>>> and valve adjust.
>>>>
>>>> Wish me luck.
>>>>
>>>> Mike
>>>>
>>>
>>> ________________________________________________________________
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>>
>>
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!
> Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!
> Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit:
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