Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 12:56:56 -0400
Reply-To: JM/CO <jmerritt2@CAPECOD.NET>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: JM/CO <jmerritt2@CAPECOD.NET>
Subject: Re: Just cause
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
This type of "cover my own ass, and to hell with society in general"
attitude is what is allowing the further spread of Fascism in America. What
do you think the 1776 generation would have had to say about this? I don't
think they would go for it one bit.
How did Adolph Hitler & Co. gain control of Germany in the early '30s? The
PEOPLE let him.
Spending a night in the local slammer never really hurt anyone. You might
learn something about how America REALLY works these days.
The part of the Constitution which is under the most assault these days is
the 4th amendment, and it's being shredded rather rapidly by GW Bush & co
we have to make the country "safe" ), although Bill Clinton's bunch was not
without guilt either. If folks are being "profiled" for driving Westys, or
whatever, we are in deep trouble in this country. Don't give into this crap.
Tell the police ( politely, of course) where to put it.
Chuck
'83 Westy
'84 Jaguar XJ-6 VDP
'86 Buick Skyhawk Hatchback
-----Original Message-----
From: joseph Trussell <joetruss@HOTMAIL.COM>
To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Date: Thursday, May 16, 2002 12:07 PM
Subject: Re: Just cause
>Outstanding. Give that speech to a southern cop. Then maybe the list will
>be nice enough to come up with your bail money.
>
>I'm not saying it's right, I'm just saying that it is how it is...You can
>talk about personal freedom all you want, but being from the Third World
>Republic of Louisiana, I've seen and heard of police doing far worse things
>to people than simply search their cars, for far less of an offense than
>being profiled.
>
>The freedom to not sit in a crappy little town's jail cell for a night for
>backtalk or assault or whatever the hell they decide to pin on you is worth
>the time for them to do a simple search.
>
>And while affecting change in the procedures of small-town cops on a
>grassroots level by being a smartass (in their views) and "politely
>declining" and possibly getting my ass thrown in jail for the greater good
>of personal freedoms for all drivers, YOU CAN HAVE IT.
>
>I'd rather be driving out of town.
>
>"A man gazing on the stars is proverbially at the mercy of the puddles in
>the road." --Alexander Smith
>
>Joe T.
>Denver, CO
>'85 GL 'bertha'
>'66 Westy
>
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>
>
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>
>
>----Original Message Follows----
>From: DaveC <voicebox@DNAI.COM>
>Reply-To: DaveC <voicebox@DNAI.COM>
>To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>Subject: Just cause
>Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 08:35:36 -0700
>
>>I was going cross country a couple of years ago in my last '85 GL, and
>>stopped in Dumas, TX to get gas and try to figure out why my clutch wasn't
>>engaging all the way...The sherriff and two deputies showed up at the gas
>>station where I was parked, probably noticed the "Widespread Panic"
sticker
>>on the back, and asked politely what I was doing and if they could search
>>my
>>vehicle.
>>
>>I obliged, and while they were searching I was busy finding the leak in my
>>clutch slave cylinder (they were very accomodating as far as me going
about
>>my business while they looked,) they did a quick run-through from front to
>>back, top to bottom, and told me I was free to go...
>>
>>Five days later, I was sitting in a beach parking lot in Pensacola Beach,
>>FL
>>eating a sandwich, and two bicycle cops rode up and asked if they could
>>take
>>a look; one of them asked me if I was smoking pot (I wasn't.) They looked
>>through the whole van, all my stuff, engine bay, etc. and didn't find
>>anything either. When they were finished, I asked them one question:
>
>-=-=-=-
>
>Why the *hell* would you consent to a voluntary search? The US
>constitution guarantees freedom from search where there is no just
>cause (something you're doing that raises their suspicions) to do so.
>(Eating a sandwich, and diagnosing a clutch problem, last time I
>looked, wasn't a suspicious behavior.) Your *guaranteed* freedoms as
>a US citizen does not require surrender of your freedom from
>unreasonable search. (Where's the logic in that?)
>
>These morons were practicing "profiling", the practice of legal
>prejudice. Don't make this kind of behavior acceptable. Politely and
>*firmly* decline the request. Every time. If they have just cause,
>they'll tell you so. If they have no just cause, they ask. Say "No".
>
>To consent to these searches makes it more and more likely that the
>others of us who don't consider owning a Vanagon just cause will be
>seen as "easy" targets by these goons.
>
>Freedom belongs only to those who choose to exercise them. The more
>you cave into fear, the fewer freedoms we all will have.
>
>Thanks for nothin'.
>
>Dave
>--
>Dave Carpenter
>
>Whatever you wish for me,
>May you have twice as much.
>
>"Sometimes I think we're alone in the universe, and sometimes I think
>we're not. In either case the idea is quite staggering." -- Arthur C.
>Clarke
>
>
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