Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 21:59:03 -0500
Reply-To: Stan Wilder <wilden1@JUNO.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Stan Wilder <wilden1@JUNO.COM>
Subject: Re: Not passing smog, still... Need help!
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
I don't relate to all the HC, CO and CO2 numbers other than to confess
I've seen them.
I took the simple approach to passing the new stricter emissions in Texas
that require running 15+ year cars on a wheel dyno. This is what I did.
#1) Changed the oil
#2) Leaned out the AFM as far as possible and still have the engine
running. Set the idle at 900 rpm. Set timing right on 7.5 (Air Cooled
Type IV).
#3) Made a 50 mile run at 70 miles an hour to check the color of my plugs
(just checked #2) looking for burn the color of coffee with cream. This
also blew out the sludge in the Catalytic converter and muffler.
I took the vehicle in while it was still at highway running temperatures.
Texas also test for NOX, the nice guy at the inspection explained it to
me in his techno Greek.
The wheel dyno was about 12" tall with the wheels located, the slope fro
run off dropped the front of the van another 4 inches so #1 & 3 cylinders
were oiling up pretty fast and the idle was down to about 450 by the time
they got all their hardware connected.
Seems the NOX was the only thing that was marginal but clearly in the
pass area.
Hope this give you some help.
On Tue, 20 Aug 2002 22:18:49 -0400 "G. Matthew Bulley"
<gmbulley@BULLEY-HEWLETT.COM> writes:
> Your HC, CO and CO2 appear fairly solid, though the HC is high at
> idle.
> Your O2 is all over the board.
>
> I'd double check the timing, clean the fuel injectors (techron) and
> text
> the 02 sensor.
> Two questions: how old is the O2 sensor, and what are the "PASS"
> numbers
> for CA?
>
>
> Developing business and guiding change since 1996,
>
> G. Matthew Bulley
> Bulley-Hewlett
> Marketing & Communications
> Business: www.bulley-hewlett.com
> AIM = IExplain4u
> Phone: +1.919.658.1278
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM] On
> Behalf
> Of Steven Dodson
> Sent: Tuesday, August 20, 2002 10:03 PM
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Subject: Re: Not passing smog, still... Need help!
>
> Here are the readings from today's smog test:
>
> 2662 RPM
> HC = 38
> CO = .06
> CO2 = 13.6
> O2 = 2.1
>
> Idle
> 900 RPM
> HC = 202
> CO = .08
> CO2 = 12.7
> O2 = 3.3
>
> Readings from the previous test. (different smog station)
>
> 2461 RPM
> HC = 39
> CO = .10
> CO2 = 15.0
> O2 = .4
>
> Idle
> 880 RPM
> HC = 199
> CO = .08
> CO2 = 14.4
> O2 = 1.8
>
> I have run 2 bottles of injector/valve cleaner through the tank.
> I have not checked the compression yet, assumed it was OK, until
> now.
> I will get a compression tester tomorrow. Timing is right on
> target.
>
> Hope this info sheds light on the problem. Thanks guys!
>
> -Steven Dodson
> Kneeland, CA
> "Inga" the 87 Syncro
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com]On
> Behalf
> Of G. Matthew Bulley
> Sent: Tuesday, August 20, 2002 5:48 PM
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Subject: Re: Not passing smog, still... Need help!
>
>
> Steven--
>
> Could you post the other numbers; (NOx, CO, CO2). The HC on its own
> is
> inconclusive. With the very limited evidence, here are a couple of
> possible leads to check.
>
> 1.. Bad O2 sensor
> 2.. low compression *(run MMO for a tank, then add Motor Honey for
> the
> test)
> 3.. crusty valves or injectors (run a bottle of Techron through the
> tank)
> 4.. timing off
> 5.. ruined cat due to expired O2 sensor for extended period
> (weeks/months)
>
> Send the full numbers, and lets go from there.
>
> Developing business and guiding change since 1996,
>
> G. Matthew Bulley
> Bulley-Hewlett
> Marketing & Communications
> Business: www.bulley-hewlett.com
> AIM = IExplain4u
> Phone: +1.919.658.1278
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM] On
> Behalf
> Of Steven Dodson
> Sent: Tuesday, August 20, 2002 7:59 PM
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Subject: Not passing smog, still... Need help!
>
> I'm still trying to smog Inga. I'm planning a diesel conversion for
> late
> spring / early summer 2003, so I don't want to dump a bunch more
> money
> into
> her.
>
> Here's some history: (skip to "problem" below if necessary, kind of
> long)
> My ex-mechanic had done a pre-purchase inspection on her, said she
> was
> solid, had good compression and was in great condition. One given
> was
> she
> wouldn't pass smog, he put a new cat and muffler on her tested it
> with
> his
> smog machine, it passed, so it appeared. A second smog check proved
> otherwise. He claimed that the smog facilities machine must be
> wrong.
> They
> did some checking and said they found some loose wires, blah, blah,
> spent
> lots of time and my money and finally claimed it was fixed and
> would
> pass
> smog, again according to their smog machine. Took it back for a
> smog
> check
> and of coarse it failed again. I took Inga to a second smog facility
> to
> rule
> out the claim of the mechanic, it failed. It was at this point that
> I
> started noticing the tacho problem, which turned out to be the ECU,
> when
> replaced that problem immediately stopped. I have since checked and
> cleaned
> out the idle stabilizer valve and controller, replaced the fuel
> filter,
> cleaned out the fuel injectors (#2 had a questionable spray pattern)
> and
> replaced plugs and wires (plugs were 100% out of spec). A third
> smog
> test
> this morning netted "FAILED".
> My ex-mechanic claimed to have done a lot of stuff, like checking
> compression. When I removed a plug, I found that the plug was dirty
> and
> gap
> was about .070", turned out all of them were like that. Also, the
> plug
> wires
> were in pour condition. You'd think that if they took the plugs out
> to
> check
> the compression, they would have seen or noted the plug and/or wire
> condition. This leads me to believe that they may not have done all
> they
> said they did during the 2.5 weeks they had Inga.
>
> The problem/s?:
> The smog is failing the idle test with HC running between 220-280
> (150
> max).
> If I adjust the CO screw, it corrects the problem, temporarily. It
> seems
> to
> me that the ECU is seeing a rich or lean mix and is adjusting
> accordingly.
> Just replaced the ECU, so I doubt it could be the cause. Could it be
> the
> Ox
> sensor? I will test that out tomorrow. When the throttle is
> released,
> the
> rpms go down to about 1100-1200 for a bit (10-30 sec) and then
> finally
> drops
> to 850-900. Would the idle stabilizer cause this? I checked it,
> cleaned
> it
> out really good and checked contacts on the controller, not that it
> makes a
> difference. I found a very small exhaust leak near #3 header (tiny
> bubbles),
> don't think this will effect the outcome much, I will fix it
> anyway.
>
> I'm a bit puzzled. Any thoughts? Thanks!
>
> -Steven Dodson
> Kneeland, CA
> "Inga" the 87 Syncro
>
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