Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 14:15:15 -0400
Reply-To: "G. Matthew Bulley" <gmbulley@BULLEY-HEWLETT.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: "G. Matthew Bulley" <gmbulley@BULLEY-HEWLETT.COM>
Organization: Bulley-Hewlett
Subject: Re: Are There Junk Ball Joints?
In-Reply-To: <IBEMIMEBBBEOIIGIKKAHKEMCGLAA.vanagon@busdepot.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Remember a couple decades ago when that whole "Made in USA" thing was
all the rage with marketers? Have you noticed that you don't see much of
that tagline anymore? It isn't because it is bad marketing, but because
people frankly don't give a cr*p where things were made, as long as the
quality is good, and the price is cheap.
That being the operating model global retail, it is not surprising if
you can't find German-made ball joints. Germany isn't so much different
from the USA. Their labor is expensive, but their manufacturing is
highly mechanized, so it makes sense to have Bangladeshi teenagers
making the ball joints, FEBI branding the ball joints, and Van-Again
selling the ball joints.
In the final analysis, you would be either shocked, disappointed, or
amazed at all the stuff that simply is no longer made ANYWHERE in the
USA. I'll stop there so Officer Hurlbut doesn't chastise me.
G. Matthew Bulley
Creator and Grand Emporer of the
VW Heat, Rust, Noise Web Page
http://www.bulley-hewlett.com/VWindex/
Owner of too many VW's to mention
-----Original Message-----
From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM] On Behalf
Of The Bus Depot
Sent: Tuesday, September 24, 2002 12:54 PM
To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
Subject: Re: Are There Junk Ball Joints?
> I went to research syncro ball joints and noticed massive price
> differences. The cheapest I could find from VW was about $90 each. But
> our vendor friends had them for about $25. Unfortunately, there was
> scant information on who the supplier was of these joints and how
> they compare to OEM joints. Importedcarparts.com said its joints
> were from Lemforder, but this name is not familiar to me and I am not
> sure that is a good thing. Importedcarparts.com also mentions that its
lower
> syncro joints are made by Febi. Is that good?
>
> So my question is whether one is safe to order any of these joints
willy
> nilly and buy by price, or whether there are different manufacturers
> of the joints and if so, who is the OEM manufacturer of them.
>
> Ron, if you are reading this, could you comment on the manufacturer of
> your joints and what it means OR by the cheaper of your two joints
> I tried to find the key to your part numbers to see what OR meant but
was
> not successful.
There are several German brands who supply Vanagon ball joints, most
notably
Febi, Meyle, and Lemforder. There are also a couple of Italian ones
(most
commonly Ocap, which is also rebranded under various other names
including
Beck-Arnley). Finally, there are lesser known suppliers in Mexico,
Brazil,
India, and Taiwan.
As has been noted before, a German brand does not necessarily guarantee
German manufacture. In this age of corperate multinationalism, most of
the
brands manufacture in a wide range of countries, regardless of where
they
are headquartered. For example, Bosch's Vanagon spark plugs are now
made in
India! I have seen German-branded ball joints made in Italy, Turkey,
and
Spain, among others.
That said, as long as you stick with a name brand such as the ones
mentioned
above, I feel that you are reasonably safe even if the product is not
actually German made. I say this for a few reasons:
1) I have had just about a zero percent defective rate on all of the
name
brand ball joints. This is generally a reliable product overall; no
matter
what name brand you buy the rate of failure is negligable. In fact I
can't
recall ever taking back a single bad ball joint. (I can't comment on
the
off-brand ones from non-German suppliers, as we have never sold them.)
2) I have generally found, when dealing with the more established name
brands (such as the above), that they tend to be somewhat careful about
what
they put their name on, German or not. These are established companies
that
have a reputation to uphold and want to build repeat business from their
dealers (such as us). So they don't just put the cheapest part they can
find in a box and attach their name/reputation to it. This may
partially
explain number 1) above.
3) You will find it difficult if not impossible to obtain true German
ones
anyway. A brand may source the identical product from multiple
factories.
So if you pulled ten Febi ball joints off the shelf, some may be made in
Germany and some not. Some may even be labeled "Germany" but not in
fact be
German. (Yes, this happens. I have seen two boxes containing visibly
identical products, right down to the castings, with one box labeled
"Germany" and the other "Italy.") Therefore, even if you ask a mail
order
supplier to check the country of origin on what he is selling, unless he
ships you the exact one he happened to look at, when it comes time to
ship
your order, the ones put in your box may or may not be from the same
country.
This is also the case if you buy the $90 ones from the VW dealer, as VW,
too, sources from multiple countries now. Someone recently commented on
this regarding water pumps. He returned another vendor's water pump
(which
was new but Italian made) and ordered one from the dealer instead. When
it
arrived, he discovered that for twice the price, the one he'd gotten was
not
only Italian as well, but remanufactured to boot!
Your only chance of being sure to get a German one would be to buy one
over-the-counter where you could examine the part at time of purchase.
(Even then, this assumes that the labeling is accurate.) But why go
through
all that hassle, considering number 1) above? Save your trouble for a
product where there _is_ a significant difference in quality.
So, my advice would be to stick with one of the name brands mentioned
above,
but beyond that I can't see any reason to recommend one over the other
(nor
can I see any reason to pay the dealer price).
Incidentally, the ones we are currently shipping are from Meyle/Germany
(although we have shipped Febi and Lemforder in the past). To answer
your
other question, the alternate ("OR") version listed on our site would be
an
aftermarket, non-German brand. Since the savings is minimal in this
case,
and availability on the German brand is not a problem at the present
time, I
wouldn't bother with it.
As usual, when ordering, don't forget to request your 5% listmember
discount
(since the order will exceed the $50 minimum for the discount).
- Ron Salmon
The Bus Depot, Inc.
(215) 234-VWVW
www.busdepot.com
_____________________________________________
Toll-Free for Orders by Part # 1-866-BUS-DEPOT
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