Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 06:23:17 -0400
Reply-To: Vanagon man <vgonman@MSN.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Vanagon man <vgonman@MSN.COM>
Subject: Re: The end of the road (86 westy runnin' rich) - LONG STORY
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I have done this same fix and it solved my problem, too.
Adam P
81 Westy "The Brick "
70 Single Cab "Whitey"
74 Beetle "Ol Yeller"
73 Transporter (STILL at paint shop)
1988 Vanagon Wolfsburg
1976 Transporter (New CA bus)
75 Campmobile "for sale'
Used Vanagon Parts for sale (mostly aircooled)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Laurence Smith" <laurence@ALANASMITH.COM>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Tuesday, October 22, 2002 12:25 AM
Subject: Re: The end of the road (86 westy runnin' rich) - LONG STORY
> Well John, I've been where you are. I know it is awfull. My Westy was
down
> from Oct 2001 - Feb 2002. 5 months of frustration and a lot of money. I
> changed every Digifant component. I was trying to solve a very serious
rich
> running condition. My symptoms were exactly the same as yours. It would
> run fine until warm and then belch out black smoke. The oxygen sensor
> voltage readings were extremely high - nothing near the 0.5 volts +/- 0.3
> volts.
>
> My Westy is a 1990. I got out the Bentley, yet again, and said I am going
> to find and check all those grounds again. I had already resoldered new
> eyelets on all of them - or so I thought. Anyway, there was one ground
that
> I had missed and it was the one I told you about in a previous email. It
is
> the one attached to the left head.
>
> Anyway, I went out to account for all 7 grounds and could only find 6
coming
> off the harness and all went to the firewall. I couldn't find the one
that
> goes under the intakes, on the head. That is, I couldn't find it coming
off
> the harness anywhere. So then I assumed that the previous owner had cut
it
> out the harness (but how would the engine run okay as long as it did? - I
> asked myself). I couldn't find it coming out of the harness so I thought
> it was just sniped back flush with the harness when the heads were done a
> few years ago. I was to be proven wrong, but I'll get to that later.
>
> I was out of ideas. I had already changed every Digifant part, some of
them
> twice, the AFM three times (god)!. So I decided that I will replace that
> "missing" ground by running a new one wire from terminal 19 on the ECU
(see
> Bentley diagrams). At the ECU connector I pulled back the rubber boot and
> found the brown wire coming off the terminal 19. I cut into the
insulation
> (didn't cut the wire) and carefully spliced in a new ground wire. I ran
the
> wire back to the engine and terminated it on the little tab on the
> distributor housing. Fully expecting yet another failure, I started the
> engine, waited for it to warm up and, and ... it ran fine. No more black
> smoke and terrible stumbling! The O2 readings were also good at 0.5 volts
> fluctuating about +/- 0.3 volts.
>
> To test my ground wire fix I took if off the distibutor and sure enough
the
> rich symptoms reappeared. I must have done this about 6 times. I was
> elated!
>
> It was the damn ECU terminal 19 ground not doing its job to provide proper
> oxygen sensor readings to the ECU. Now I know, I know, I know, that your
O2
> sensor has been disconnected, replaced, sweaked, fiddled with ad nauseum.
I
> did all the O2 fiddling as well. But the terminal 19 ground wire has a
mind
> of its own and doesn't give a damn about the state of the O2 sensor.
>
> Anyway I tidied eveything up and ran my Westy until June 2002. No rich
> problems at all.
>
> Then I had to do my water pump. While I was doing this I had to run a new
> small oil cooler pipe under the intakes back to the thermostat housing.
> What's this wire I see? The elusive ground wire from terminal 19! It
> doesn't come out of the harness in an obvious spot, it branches off the
> sheath of wires that goes to the hall sender. The connection was in poor
> shape. So to make the ECU terminal 19 become super grounded, I now have
two
> good ground wires.
>
> Anyway, that's my story. I spent a huge amount of time and money on this
> problem and it was a simple ground. On the bright side, I am now a
Digifant
> "expert" and have helped several other people with identical problems as
> myself.
>
> So, if you have checked out that ground wire and the green wires seems to
be
> in good shape, my advice to you is to purchase a replacement green O2 wire
> and run it back to the ECU and splice the 2 coaxial components into the
wire
> bundle near the ECU. VW actually sells just this wire because of problems
> with them internally shorting. It is coaxial. While you're at it, I
would
> also run a new terminal 19 ground wire back to the engine.
>
> If you want to talk to me on the phone please call me at home and I can
> better explain any of these details. My number is (905) 524-5205 up here
in
> Canada.
>
> Hang in there!
>
> - Laurence
>
>
>
>
> Laurence Smith
> Hamilton, ON
> 90 Westy (fanumbos)
>
>
>
> ---------------------------
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM]On Behalf Of
> john cianci
> Sent: Monday, October 21, 2002 7:40 PM
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Subject: The end of the road (86 westy runnin' rich)
>
>
> Well I guess the saga is coming to an end....again thanks for all the
> help...the westy has been in the shop for close to two months now and we
> still can't fugure out whats wrong...so far been through ecu, o2 sensor,
MAF
> is OK, Fuel pressure is fine, the westy runs great when its cold but as
> soon as she warms up....down the tubes... She doesn't run any better with
> teh maf unplugged, o2 unplugged. We checked the thermostat, temp switch, a
> crap load of grounds have been replaced.... We are at a loss here don't
know
> where to go next....any more ideas would be great...so far ideas have been
> hall sendor ground, capacitor in AFM, grounds, injectors, air filter,
wow...
> I don't know what to do...tahnks again everyone. John
>
>
> John Cianci
> Research Assistant
> Department of Civil and Environmental Engineering
> Clarkson University
> 315-268-3776
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
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