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Date:         Sun, 24 Nov 2002 22:21:48 -0800
Reply-To:     David Marshall <vanagon@VOLKSWAGEN.ORG>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         David Marshall <vanagon@VOLKSWAGEN.ORG>
Subject:      Re: Attention TDI Gurus!  What is hotter, oil or compressed air?
Comments: To: Karl M <thewestyman@MINDSPRING.COM>
In-Reply-To:  <01fd01c29449$3ab418c0$fe20bc3f@com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

I have seen oil temps go up to 130 to 135 on my AAZ. My friend in Vancouver Island is running an RX7 oil cooler and there is a very big problem with these - there is a thermostat in the input of the cooler. We are using a sandwich adapter which has a thermostat so when it opens the oil didn't go into the cooler until the heat transferred down the line to open the cooler thermostat - thus WAY to late to do any real good. Removing the cooler thermostat brought his oil temps down to about 115C max. I won't be using an RX7 cooler - rather an industrial (read more rock proof) cooler that is about the same size as the RX7 unit. Currently on my 1.9TD I am running a 'bug pack' cooler - I wasn't sure if it was doing any good until the cheap oil line broke and I removed it when I was on the side of the road - fun fun fun - the result was a rock steady 120C that increased to 125C - this was with the out side temp about 10C - the cooler was mounted on my cross member next to the wheel. In both cases, I and my friend are also using the factory water > oil cooler (warmer) as well.

David Marshall

Fast Forward Automotive Inc. 4356 Quesnel Hixon Road Quesnel BC Canada V2J 6Z3

http://www.fastforward.ca mailto:sales@fastforward.ca Phone: (250) 992 7775 FAX: (250) 992 1160

- Vanagon Accessories and Engine Conversions - Vanagon, Transporter and Iltis Sales and Importation - European Lighting for most Volkswagen models

-----Original Message----- From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com]On Behalf Of Karl M Sent: November 24, 2002 10:09 PM To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM Subject: Re: Attention TDI Gurus! What is hotter, oil or compressed air?

David,

My findings are that the stock oil-water oil cooler is just fine unless you are doing heavy towing. Using this cooler in my TD, oil temps rarely pass 120C. The Mazda oil cooler needs more airflow than it will see in your planned location. I think it needs higher-pressure air, like is available at the nose of the van. I tried a Mazda cooler in rear locations and oil temps soared, even in winter, to near 140 C. The intercooler also needs better airflow than will be had in the engine compartment. Think about an air-to-water intercooler system. VW, Subaru, Audi and others are now using those. Good luck in your project.

Karl Mullendore Westy Ventures 1987 Westfalia Syncro 1.9TD

----- Original Message -----

> I am doing the final - on paper design of my ALH TDI installation that will > be going into my Syncro DoKa over the winter. From what I have heard from a > lot of TD and TDI owners and from my personal experience with a 1.9L AAZ > Turbo Diesel is the oil temps can get damn hot with the turbo working all > the time. > > The plan is to use a bigger than stock charge air cooler (Audi 5000 or Saab > 900) and an external air cooled oil cooler (Mazda RX-7). With the > experimentation that I have done with my oil cooler on my 1.9 AAZ I have > realised there isn't a 100% optimal location for it under the van and moving > it up front isn't an option for me. The plan is to mount the charge air > cooler and the oil cooler horizontally in a sandwich configuration on the > passenger side of the engine bay about 1/2 way up the height of the engine. > This is to keep it away from the hot exhaust manifold on the driver side and > when mounting everything at 15 degrees there is lots of room on the > passenger side. The design of the Vanagon makes it so there is air moving > around the engine when you are driving as it did begin life as an air-cooled > vehicle so I feel no matter what angle I mount the coolers at it will > provide some benefit. So, driving on cold to warm days (less than 20C) the > setup would do a 'better than it if wasn't there job' of cooling the > compressed air and the engine oil. When the temp goes beyond 20C things > will start to get a little warmer in the engine bay - especially if you are > moving at non-highway speeds. On most 1988 and newer VWs and Audi sedans > there is a temperature sensor on the valve cover - this temp sensor will > turn on the radiator fan when the engine is too hot to get air moving > through the radiator and more importantly over the engine to cool things > off. The plan is to use a fan (Golf radiator fan) to move air up and > through the charge air cooler and the oil cooler when the engine gets really > hot. When is this? Stop and go traffic, super aggressive driving (8% grade > in hot weather) and after you have parked the vehicle. Temps in the back of > the van get REALLY hot after you have parked it. The fan will have two > functions - it will draw air up through the coolers and circulate it over > the engine to help cool it off. > > So in making the cooler sandwich, which one should be on top - the air or > oil cooler? > > David Marshall


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