Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 15:08:46 -0600
Reply-To: John Rodgers <j_rodgers@CHARTER.NET>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: John Rodgers <j_rodgers@CHARTER.NET>
Subject: Re: External Heat System for Vans
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
My idea of the external heat system is more for events when the vehicle
is stationary ...... camping or just parked. It would make no sense when
on the road because you DO have the heat from the engine cooling system.
But you do not run and engine all the time when parked.
When stationary, as in parked in a campground or where-ever, the heat
source would be outside the vehicle. Therefore little danger of
combustion products or fire.
John Rodgers
88 GL Driver
Michael Norden wrote:
> Fun Idea about the heat. I was thinking of the same idea for a hot tub,
> since I've got a fire going in the winter anyway, heat the tub partially
> for free.
>
> But in a vehicle, why the risk danger of flame when you have the heat
> source of the engine? Could you coil wrap the exhaust manifold? The
> muffler? Also just mulling the possibilities.
>
> Mike
> '85 Doka in Tacoma
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf
> Of John Rodgers
> Sent: Sunday, December 15, 2002 10:17 AM
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Subject: External Heat System for Vans
>
> Just doing some Sunday morning musings about heating and cooling the
> interiors of the various Vanagon configurations.
>
> Someone has come up with and posted to a web site a relatively portable
> AC system for dealing with summer heat, i.e., hanging one of the new
> small 115 volt domestic window air conditioners in the passenger window
> of the van. If there is power available, either generator or electric
> service, that works. So much for the summer heat when camping.
>
> What about dealing with the cold in winter when camping? I know there
> are various heaters of various kinds. There are the fuel fired
> combustion blower types that are installed under the seat. There are the
> catalytic types that work, but they introduce moisture and some nasty
> possibilities, i.e., carbon monoxide poisoning.
>
> My thoughts ran to a visit I made one winter with some Indian folk on
> the Yukon River once. It was cold as rip that winter, minus 40F outside.
> The family had a steel drum set up as a wood stove. The barrel stood on
> end, with a cast iron door on one side, and a cast iron circle on top so
> a chimney stack could be mounted. That heater kept their little house
> toasty. And they had a tub full of hot water for various uses. The hot
> water was generated by thermo-siphon principle. There was a copper tube
> wrapped around that drum several times to form a coil. The end of bottom
> wrap of the coiled copper was in the bottom of the tub. The upper end
> was in the top of the tub. Both ends were in the water. The tube was
> completely filled, so there was continuous loop of water with no air in
> it. As the cold water in the bottom of the coil heated, it would begin
> to rise, displacing the water above back into the tub. At the same time
> drawing cold water from the bottom of the tub. Through this process they
> had a continuous flow of water heating all the time with no pumps
> required.
>
> To apply the principle to the Vanagons, and get any flame outside the
> van, one could arrange in principle a radiator of some type connected to
> a feed and return line, the two ends going to a heating point outside
> the van where a propane flame could heat a fluid (water & antifreeze).
> The radiator could be installed similarly as the window mount AC, the
> heated fluid would rise and as it cooled in the radiator it would settle
> back to towards the burner to be reheated again. To distribute the heat
> from the radiator, a small low power air circulating fan could be
> installed in conjunction to the radiator. If one has a deep cycle
> secondary battery in the van it would carry that air circulating fan for
> quite a while even with a cold battery, but if the inside of the van
> were kept warm, and there fore the battery kept warm, the charge on the
> battery would be extended.
>
> This could be totally closed, portable system using flexible hoses, and
> could be set up in just a few minutes. I suppose it might even be
> possible to integrate connections into the vehicles cooling system so as
> to use the onboard heater fans. That would just need to be looked into.
> It would require a circulating pump in the fluid circuit, however.
>
> Just mulling the possibilities this morning. Hoping someone with a shop
> might tackle this idea and see if would reasonably work.
>
> John Rodgers
> 88 GL Driver
>
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