Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 19:13:32 -0800
Reply-To: David Marshall <vanagon@VOLKSWAGEN.ORG>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: David Marshall <vanagon@VOLKSWAGEN.ORG>
Subject: Re: Bad Tiico's and Good Samaritans (story)
In-Reply-To: <1d3.6884bf.2b5ec382@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Bill,
Quite the tale - I hate taking big trips too - almost six years ago I was
heading from British Columbia to Saskatchewan (20h drive) and my newly
'rebuilt' transmission blew up on my rabbit pickup about 30 minutes outside
of Jasper (read middle of nowhere). To make matters worse we had to be in
Saskatchewan by the next morning for my wife's parents 50 wedding
anniversary. It was a parking lot swap and to make a long story short it
did work out for us - just! I hope that it all works out in the end.
Anyhow - unless this motor is totally different than any other 8V motor that
I have worked on or it has a non stock cam shaft (compared to North American
and European cams) this motor should be a non-interference motor meaning
that a broken timing belt should not spell crushed valves. If this was a
16V motor it would be a different story. If you take the valve cover off
you will notice that some of the lifters do not touch the cam. This is
normal there should be about (I don't have the exact measure) 0.5mm of space
there - just enough to say there is space. From my experience, I have often
set a motors timing 180 degrees out and it never fires up - well the
occasional back fire will occur! The best way to time an I4 motor is to set
the cam to TDC by removing the valve cover and lining up the mark on the cam
pulley to the top of the cylinder head. Next, remove spark plug #1 (closest
to the pulleys) and stick the rubber end of a pencil down there and turn the
motor over by hand until the pencil show TDC as it won't go up any further.
VW timing marks are never 100% as I am finding out. Then at this point take
a paint market and make a mark on the timing mark on the v-belt pulley and
the plastic belt guard - I always do my timing from this end of the motor
using MY marks. Then, make sure the distributor is pointing to sparkplug #4
and line the mark on the distributor up with the rotor - when the cap is on
this is cylinder #1. The firing order for an I4 is 1-3-4-2. If you follow
this and there are no faults in the ignition system it should be timed close
enough to fire up and run OK. I usually set the timing to 4 to 6 degrees
before top dead center (what ever sounds the best).
It is so great to see people like Bill in this world. I always stop and
offer assistance to my fellow VW driver who has broken down on the side of
the road. One of these days I will need their help I am sure!
David Marshall
Fast Forward Automotive Inc.
4356 Quesnel-Hixon Road
Quesnel BC Canada V2J 6Z3
http://www.fastforward.ca mailto:sales@fastforward.ca
Phone: (250) 992 7775 FAX: (250) 992 1160
- Vanagon Accessories and Engine Conversions
- Vanagon, Transporter and Iltis Sales and Importation
- European Lighting for most Volkswagen models
-----Original Message-----
From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com]On Behalf
Of Bill Marshall
Sent: January 21, 2003 7:39 AM
To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
Subject: Bad Tiico's and Good Samaritans (story)
I hate my Tiico engine, and it hates me.
January 17th, all of my belongings were loaded into a big moving van,
speeding across the country. My wife and I were moving from Florida to
Chicago. We loaded up the vanagon the night before, with some necessities
for the trip and camping gear for staying in the new house until the moving
truck arrived. The van was checked out -- oil, coolant, hoses looked good,
no leaks, wires all tight, plugs clean. Everything in good shape. Early
that morning, we set out for Tennessee and an overnight stop, before heading
into Chicago.
Everything was great. We made it through Florida slightly ahead of
schedule.
As we drove through Georgia, everything was still fine. It was about 1 PM,
and the drive had been easy. Suddenly, in a construction zone, we lose all
power. I coast down a little hill, and make it past a bridge under
construction before I find a place to pull over. Just great, I think to
myself. I've got the van stuffed full -- my wife and I, our 2 greyhounds,
and our cat in a big plastic carrier, in addition to lots of other stuff we
were taking with us.
I tried to start the engine. It turned over rapidly, and didn't fire. I
hopped out and began the external troubleshooting. No big fuel leak. Fuel
pump making correct sounds. No wires hanging. Starter still tight. I have
the wife turn over the engine. It spins rapidly, with a weird whining and
clicking. Time to go in.
We start unloading our belongings on the side of the road. Dogs and cat get
pushed forward. On a positive note, it was sunny and warm. I get the
decklid off and take a look inside. Nothing obvious, nothing hanging off or
broken. I always hope for the easy stuff, but no luck. The wife turns over
the engine, and again rapid spinning with the occasional clicking. About 5
minutes later, it hits me. I check the little crack where you can see the
timing belt, and have the engine turned again. No movement.
Oh crap, I'm in the middle of nowhere and I need a South African version of
a
German timing belt.
I talk to the wife about what it is, and what we have to do. I grab a cell
phone, but have no one to call. My brilliant move of the day was to get out
and walk back to the construction zone. I found the foreman, and explained
my situation to him. He called around and eventually had his supervisor
call
the sheriff who called a dispatcher who knew a guy who tows. We were in
business. An hour later, we were on the back of truck.
The nice gentleman who drove the truck was a great, helpful guy. However,
he
spoke a version of English that we northerners don't quite understand.
Everything he said got repeated, sometimes twice. Some things we still
don't
understand. Oh well. He new of only one VW place, and it was in Valdosta,
about an hour back. With no other option at the time, we went.
The VW dealer in Valdosta was nice, but was backed up for 2 weeks. I
pleaded
with him, to no avail. He did know some other mechanics in the area who did
VW stuff, and called them for me. I talked to a couple guys before I got
ahold of Bill Clapp. He agreed to work on it right away. I got the parts
from the dealer and away we went.
Bill had come to the dealer to pick us up, and have the tow truck follow
him.
We went deep into the woods. Two roads after the pavement ended, we were
at
Bill's compound. I felt a lot better when I saw his place. He had bunches
of VW's, various models in various states of repair. It turns out he is a
restorer of VW's, specializing in Bugs and Ghias. We roll right in and put
the van on a lift.
Bill had never heard of or seen a Tiico, but he knew a bit about the Golf
and
Jetta, so he was somewhat familiar. He had a look, and pulled off
components, until the belt was revealed. The REAL problem then presented
itself.
The belt had not broken. There was some collateral damage to it, but it was
still intact. The problem was the tensioner pulley. The bearing had failed
and burned out, freezing up. The cheap plastic guide pulley then melted,
and
the belt skipped off. The pulley failed at 27,000 miles. These engines
suck.
At this point, we realize that we have the wrong replacement belt and
pulley.
Bill doesn't have one in stock, so he makes us dinner, and after we drive
off to the parts store. Did I mention that Bill was a great guy? We drove
to the store in his restored bug, a piece of art if I've ever seen one. The
oversized fenders where white, and the body was a prismatic paint that
reflected every color from gold to purple to green. Beautiful. The new
tensioner we got was only $27 dollars, and had a metal pulley.
We worked late into the evening. Bill put up my wife and dogs in his house,
where they were entertained by playing children, singing and music playing.
Great hospitality to a couple of strangers and their dogs! We got the belt
and tensioner on, and tried to start the engine. Sadly, it still spun and
wouldn't start. We peeked under the valve cover, and found that some of the
lifter weren't touching the cams.
Bent valves.
The Tiico is a high-compression engine (10-to-1), so losing the timing meant
catastrophe. The pistons slammed into the open valves, bending them and
jamming them into the guides. They are stuck open, so no compression,
expansion, etc. The head is screwed.
At this point, our only option in to rent a car to get us to our house
before
the moving truck arrived. Bill put us up for the night, letting us and our
dogs stay in his master bedroom while he slept on the couch. What a guy!
It
turns out that Bill was raised in South America, where hospitality to
strangers is an art form. He and his wife were absolutely great to us, and
we are in his debt.
The next morning, Bill drove me to the local "airport" to rent a car. No
minivans available, the best thing was a Kia Sportage with a roof rack. We
got us and the pets in it, plus some other stuff, and a big load on the
roof.
We still left more than half of our stuff in the vanagon. We thanked Bill,
and arranged for him to continue repairing it so that we can go back in the
future and pick it up. The drive to Chicago was long, and we arrived at 4
AM, but we made it.
The Vanagon is still shop-bound, will be done this week. I just gotta
figure
out how to get it: fly down & drive back, have it trucked, or find someone
who need to go from Valdosta, GA to Chicago, IL.
The moral of the story?
-there are good people in the world, and if you are lucky you can find the
best of them when you need them the most.
-don't buy a Tiico engine -- get a used engine and do it yourself
-even when bad things happen, lots of good things can follow. We lost the
van, but we were so lucky otherwise it was weird.
PS: Free plug for our rescuer, who does awesome restoration work and has
won
awards for it:
Bill Clapp
Clapp's Custom Automotive Refinishing
Valdosta, Georgia
229-561-1495
Bill Marshall
'85 GL Tiico "Pandora"
Aurora, IL
