Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 09:58:27 -0800
Reply-To: fortinoj@SPEAKEASY.NET
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Joseph Fortino <fortinoj@SPEAKEASY.NET>
Subject: Re: Open container law
Content-Type: text/plain
salute! Farfrompukin
On 27 Feb 2003, Matthew Pollard wrote:
> in idaho there is no open containiner law :-)
> as long as the driver ain't drunk. the
> passangers can drink all they want. in any
> vehicle.
>
> Matthew Pollard "Racing with the wind and
> flirting with death Dept. Of Chemistry So have
> a cup of coffee and catch your breath"
> University of Idaho www.uidaho.edu/~poll7356
>
>
>
> On Thu, 27 Feb 2003, jbrrr510
> <jbrrr510@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Wow you get serious bonus points!!!
> >
> > Thank you... I think it's legal, I found the
> > following definitions at:
> >
> > http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/dl648/dl648pt-
> > 13.htm
> >
> > Camper?structure designed to be mounted to a
> > vehicle which provides facilities for human
> > habitation or camping. VC § 243
> >
> > Housecar ? motor vehicle originally
> > designed, or permanently altered, and
> > equipped for human habitation, or to
> > which a camper has been permanently
> > attached. VC §362
> >
> > Motorhome ? vehicle designed to provide
> > temporary living quarters, built as an
> > integral part of, or permanently attached
> > to, a self- propelled motor vehicle chassis
> > or van.
> >
> > If you google search you can find the entire
> > California Vehicle Code, in PDF format at
> > least: http://misnt1.sbcusd.k12.ca.us/safet-
> > y/Codes-pdf/CalVehCode.pdf
> >
> > Anyway, it has a slightly longer definition
> > of a "Housecar" in (See CVC Division 1
> > Section 362). I think one could easily argue
> > that a Westphalia falls into this "Housecar"
> > category, as it is "permanently altered, and
> > equipped for human habitation". Neither
> > definition gives specific requirements for
> > "habitation" (ie. the IRS requires a toilet
> > and sink the CVC doesn't seem to indicate
> > this in any way).
> >
> > Therefore I am of the belief that it is
> > legal for passengers to drink in the back of
> > a Westphalia Vanagon even while it is being
> > driven within the state of California. I'd
> > note of course that per the CVC sections you
> > quoted below it is clear that any opened
> > containers would need to be kept and stored
> > aft of the "driver" area.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In vanagon@yahoogroups.com,
> > blbachman@a... wrote:
> > > I grew up in CA and after a couple of
> > > tickets got arrogant enough
> > that I kept a copy of the Vehicle Code in
> > the car (for study and 'confrontation').
> > >
> > > Nevertheless, it seems pretty confusing to
> > > me...
> > >
> > > *******************************
> > > Drinking in Motor Vehicle
> > > 23221. (a) No driver shall drink any
> > > alcoholic beverage while in
> > a motor vehicle upon a highway.
> > >
> > > (b) No passenger shall drink any alcoholic
> > > beverage while in a
> > motor vehicle upon a highway.
> > >
> > > Amended Sec. 2, Ch. 723, Stats. 1999.
> > > Effective January 1, 2000.
> > > **********************
> > >
> > > That was pretty simple, and...
> > >
> > > **********************
> > > Storage of Opened Container
> > > 23225. (a) (1) It is unlawful for the
> > > registered owner of any
> > motor vehicle to keep in a motor vehicle,
> > when the vehicle is upon any highway or on
> > lands, as described in subdivision (b) of
> > Section 23220, any bottle, can, or other
> > receptacle containing any alcoholic beverage
> > that has been opened, or a seal broken, or
> > the contents of which have been partially
> > removed, unless the container is kept in the
> > trunk of the vehicle.
> > >
> > > (2) If the vehicle is not equipped with a
> > > trunk and is not an off-
> > highway motor vehicle subject to
> > identification, as defined in Section 38012,
> > the bottle, can, or other receptacle
> > described in paragraph (1) shall be kept in
> > some other area of the vehicle that is not
> > normally occupied by the driver or
> > passengers. For the purposes of this
> > paragraph, a utility compartment or glove
> > compartment shall be deemed to be within the
> > area occupied by the driver and passengers.
> > >
> > > (b) Subdivision (a) is also applicable to
> > > a driver of a motor
> > vehicle if the registered owner is not
> > present in the vehicle.
> > >
> > > (c) This section shall not apply to the
> > > living quarters of a
> > housecar or camper.
> > >
> > > ***********************
> > >
> > > That muddied the waters a bit...
> > >
> > > ***********************
> > >
> > > Possession of Alcoholic Beverages:
> > > Exceptions
> > > 23229. (a) Except as provided in Section
> > > 23229.1 (which describes
> > the situation when minors are in the
> > vehicle), Sections 23221 and 23223 do not
> > apply to passengers in any bus, taxicab, or
> > limousine for hire licensed to transport
> > passengers pursuant to the Public Utilities
> > Code or proper local authority, or the
> > living quarters of a housecar or camper.
> > >
> > > (b) Except as provided in Section 23229.1,
> > > Section 23225 does not
> > apply to the driver or owner of a bus,
> > taxicab, or limousine for hire licensed to
> > transport passengers pursuant to the Public
> > Utilities Code or proper local authority.
> > >
> > > ***************************
> > >
> > > So, it would appear that the only question
> > > you need to consider is
> > whether or not the Westfalia, while driving
> > down the highway, is considered a passenger
> > vehicle or a 'housecar'. Who knows how this
> > is determined. If CA has special 'RV'
> > plates, perhaps it requires that the vehicle
> > be thusly equipped.
> > >
> > > -bb
> >
> >
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