Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 22:20:56 -0500
Reply-To: Stan Wilder <wilden1@JUNO.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Stan Wilder <wilden1@JUNO.COM>
Subject: Re: Has anyone saved a burnt engine?
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
I didn't save an engine but I had first hand experience tearing a burnt
81 Air Cooled down after the magnesium fan shroud melted/ burnt, burnt
the fan off, burnt the rear engine aluminum engine yoke off, aluminum was
starting to sag at the oil gallery on the rear of the engine.
Every bolt was loose enough to remove with just your fingers.
Opening the engine up I found badly pitted cylinder walls, locked crank,
locked piston in cylinder.
There was a fair amount of rust in the combustion chambers and the valve
cover gaskets were burnt out.
The plastic shields were burnt off the Tranny, the starter Bakelite was
blistered and the starter cables were burn away.
The fire pretty much consumed the entire rear half of the van.
The crank was welded to the #3 main bearing.
When I could unscrew the case bolts by hand that was an alarm for me.
All in all even the sheet metal was useless.
I made it a point to throw away every part of this engine, I'd hate to be
tempted to trust any of the parts.
Considering I buy 80-83 Air Cooled engines out of wrecking yards for
85/100$, it just wasn't worth the risk of using anything from this
engine.
-----------------------
In your case I think I'd check the cylinder head torque, let it sit a few
days and check it again. If there aren't any changes then I'd say the
steel parts haven't been annealed.
Stan Wilder
On Mon, 3 Mar 2003 11:59:36 -0800 Robert Keezer <warmerwagen@HOTMAIL.COM>
writes:
> The question is,
> has anyone who reads this list put back in service an engine that
> came from
> a Vanagon that had a engine compartment fire?
>
> I have such an engine and it after tearing it down to the case ,I
> have
> discovered it is a brand new engine.
>
> The Vanagon it came out of had an engine fire that was put out
> before it
> could melt the plastic engine lid .
>
> I think I have figured how the fire originated also.
> It was human error- the installer may not have connected a hose or
> left the
> brittle adaptor on the firewall, and gasoline leaked out. The engine
> was
> running, the giniton wire melted all the way to the key, melting
> the
> ignition switch and freezing the key in the on position.
>
> The fire was quickly extinguished, both rear quarter windows were
> smashed
> out and the also the rear hatch window.
>
> The rear hatch was locked, so the lock and consequently the hatch
> was
> damaged in order to open the hatch.
>
> It looks like a fire department save, because a Vanagon mechanic
> would know
> that smashing out the side windows would avail nothing)Or would he?
> Maybe
> the installer wasn't a VW specialist.
>
> Anyway, I have removed the engine and the burnt components. It looks
> like
> the flames never touched the top engine surface. The head gaskets
> did'nt
> burn. The engine was full of coolant.
>
> No fire burnt under the engine, which is shiny new. It has a yellow
> engine
> sticker that tells it was remanufactured at Cummins Canada. The
> sticker
> did'nt burn.
>
> The case scrubbed up to a new shiny metal. It was only smoked.
> A lot melted plastic covered the top of the case.
> I don't know at what temperature these plastics melt at, but I would
> guess
> below 500 degrees, and the plastic would create an insulating
> barrier from
> the heat above.
> Also, at the base of a fire is a layer of air.
>
> Since the engine case itself never ignited, but the components above
> it did,
> the rubber intake boot for example, then this air layer would be
> even
> greater, much like the air space below a fireplace grate.
>
> I'm grateful fpor any comments on your experience or scientific
> observations.
>
> Thanks-
>
> Robert K
>
> 1982 Westfalia
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> The alternator, AC comp, PS pump, airbox/afm, intake manifolds,
> injctors
> /fuel rails, everything above the case was toasted.
> But no to the point of total consumption, most of the burnt -melted
> components were still recognizeable, except for the airbox, which
> melted and
> the AFM, which melted also.
>
> The engimne turns over readily, and there is no evidence of head
> gasket
> leaks.
>
> Any suggestions?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Robert
> 1982 Westfalia
>
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