Date:         Tue, 19 Aug 2003 12:34:45 -0700
Reply-To:     Robert Keezer <warmerwagen@HOTMAIL.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Robert Keezer <warmerwagen@HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject:      Re: Vanagon Double Relay wiring confusion
Comments: To: tomyoung1@COMCAST.NET
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed

One easy way to explain the relays is this: 30 is Battery positive always
hot,  15 0r 86 is Key-on or switched -on power to the computer power relay
and the fuel pump relay.

85 is ground or NEG, but the two relays are grounded differently. The ECM
terminal 85 goes to frame ground.

The fuel pump ground goes to the ECM , which goes to terminal 28 of the ECM,
which controls the ground for the fuel pump relay.

If the PO has changed the color codes in the harness, then you should get
the color codes right first, then trace every wire.

Get a Bentley to do it right or you risk frying something, as the white
wires serve a variety of inputs, like the auxilliary air regulator and cold
start valve, fuel pump, etc.

Robert K

1982 Westfalia


----Original Message Follows----
From: Tom Young <tomyoung1@COMCAST.NET>
Reply-To: Tom Young <tomyoung1@COMCAST.NET>
To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
Subject: Vanagon Double Relay wiring confusion
Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2003 09:38:09 -0700

Hi all:

When I purchased my '82 Federal Westfalia last year I dropped the engine and
all the related electronics (e.g., wiring harness, AFM, ICU, ECU, etc.) out
of my '81 California Vanagon and installed it in the Westfalia.  I'm making
the Westfalia "Federal" again and I have a question regarding the double
relay and its wiring.

As you know, the dual relay has two plugs that go into it.  The plug that
connects on the right side has all white wires coming out of it and these
wires all disappear into the wiring harness that runs across the front of
the engine.

Question:  I assume this is the side of the double relay that stays active
while the engine is running, controlled by the switch in the AFM?

The plug that connects on the left side of the double relay has wires that
are all colored, (red, black, blue/red, etc.) and these wires disappear into
a sheath that goes into the connection box on the left side of the engine
compartment.

Question: I assume this is the "startup" portion of the relay, energized
initially by the starter motor being activated?

Anyway, back when I removed the Federal engine and its components I noticed
that the left side plug (colored wires) had a black wire that came out of
one of the connectors on the plug with the other end attached to a screw on
the front firewall.  Clearly a non-factory modification.  What I'm trying to
understand is what this wire is doing (well, it's obviously grounding that
connection) and how it fits into the original scheme of things.

The black wire in question goes into the terminal marked "3" on the plug
which fits into terminal "85" on the relay.  Looking at the wiring diagram,
it appears that the wire coming out of this terminal should be white, going
on over to terminal 28 at the ECU.

Question: is this correct?

Since the vehicle was running in its "Federal" configuration when I bought
it, I guess that the ECU must be grounding this terminal as well.  But, are
there any "issues" with having the terminal permanently grounded, the way it
is?  Off hand, it doesn't seem like there could be, since the left side of
the dual relay is energized only when the starter motor is turning over and
is out of the game otherwise.

Any Vanagon electrical experts out there that can help me out here?

TIA!

---------------------------------------------------------------
Tom Young                       '81 Vanagon
Lafayette, CA 94549         '82 Westfalia
---------------------------------------------------------------


Robert
1982 Westfalia 1987 Wolfsburg

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