Date:         Mon, 22 Sep 2003 20:14:22 -0800
Reply-To:     Mark Tuovinen <mst@AK.NET>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Mark Tuovinen <mst@AK.NET>
Subject:      Re: WANTED: winter tires
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

John, you are not "totally" disagreeing with me, nor do I totally disagree with you.

Re: "I have to totally disagree withMark. The purpose of the heavy tread on a
snow tire is to keep drive wheels from spinning when torque is applied to
them. It does nothing for improving steering."

The purpose of the heavy tread is not to keep the drive wheels from spinning, it is for bite. The lugs are there to allow the tire to bite into a heavy snow fall, similar to the way mud tires on an off-road vehicle do. The item used to keep the tires from spinning is called the BRAIN! Any tire will spin if you press hard enough on the accelerator pedal.

Re: "When front wheel drive cars were introduced, it was quickly discovered that
having STUDDED tires on the front only would cause the car to spin under
hard braking. It whas therefore recommended (in some places mandated) that
front wheel dirve cars that ran STUDS had to have studs on all 4 wheels."

Yes, front wheel drive cars spin when braking hard while running studs on the drive wheels only, but they will also break traction under normal driving just by deccelerating for a curve or turn. A competent driver can do fine with either front only or all 4 studded tires. Inexperienced or aggressive drivers should have studs on all 4 corners.

Re: "Over the years a belief that this somehow applied to RWD vehicles developed.
It's nonsense, and will actually degrade performance when the road isn't
snow covered."

A snow tire is not meant to have the same performance as street tires and therefore will not handle the same when the road is not snow covered, this is apples and oranges.

Re: "And 2wd vanagons with studded snows on the rear and quality tires on the
front do quite well in the snow."

Yes 2wd vanagons do well with studs on the rear only, but they would benefit from having all 4 tires studded. The bottom line is still the driver. A good driver can get around 99% of the time without snow tires at all. Inexperienced drivers, and those in geographically challenging areas will do much better with studded tires(if allowed to use them). I have driven rear wheel, front wheel, four wheel, and all wheel drive vehicles in Alaska for the last 25 years. These last few years I have not put studded tires on my daily drivers and been fine, but there have been days when they would have been nice to have.

Mark in AK


My $0.02

John Flaherty
Portland, Maine
'84 GL

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Tuovinen" <mst@AK.NET>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Monday, September 22, 2003 3:23 PM
Subject: WANTED: winter tires


> Skip the Blizzaks, get a set(4) Nokian Hakkapelitta's. They will cost more
initially, but less in the long run. They will give you better traction,
less road noise, and last longer than anything I have ever driven on. Note:
I work for an automobile dealership in Anchorage, AK and have driven on many
different tires with & w/o studs in the last 25yrs here. While a rear wheel
drive can get by with snow tires on the rear only, I do not recommend it. By
running snow tires on the drive wheels only you compromise your vehicles
handling and braking abilities. The few extra dollars saved when you buy
only two tires will disappear rapidly when you pay your insurance deductible
after an accident.
>
> Mark in AK
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hey guys,
> I'm getting ready to do my first chicago winter with my "new" '84 vanagon
> that I picked up this summer.  AS I sometimes hit rough conditions, I was
> planning on putting some snow tires on, at least on the back.  I'm looking
> for a good deal, so I'd take good quality used tires.  Ideally I think I'd
> like to pick up some blizzaks, but I'm probably willing to be flexible
> there.  Any sellers or suggestions?
>
> Thanks a bunch,
> wes
> '84 vanagon 175,500