Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 02:23:17 -0500
Reply-To: John Rodgers <jh_rodgers@BELLSOUTH.NET>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: John Rodgers <jh_rodgers@BELLSOUTH.NET>
Subject: Re: Tools for engine overhaul on 85 waterboxer
In-Reply-To: <0ae301c428cb$c9700390$6401a8c0@yoursz6x6sefxo>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Bob is right on target here. My experience is heavy on the aircraft side
in the world of engines, but restoring fits and clearances were the key
to a rebuild, and you simply could not do it without micrometers and
dial indicators.
The engines all had overhaul manuals that were pretty good provided they
were updated with any changes. As I recall there were three levels of
"Overhaul".
Field overhaul - local mechanic rebuilt the engine insuring by measuring
with micrometers that the fits and clearances on all parts were within
the maximum wear limits specified. This meant that if a spec called for
minimum of .010 and max of .015 inches then if the part was .015 or
less it was allowable to be reused. So you could get an overhauled
engine with parts right at the wear limit. You really had to be careful
about who you let overhaul your engine in the field.
Re-manufacture Overhaul: This type rebuild brought fits and clearances
into spec by adjusting contacting surfaces by grinding and using
oversize, undersize parts whose combined use would bring the clearances
into new spec limits. Case in point would be grinding a worn crankshaft
to be true, but which now requires a non-stock bearing because the part
is undersize. The clearance now is a like-new clearance, but the parts
have been altered to make them work. Nothing wrong with this and it is
done all the tme with no problems, but know what you are paying for.
Factory re-manufacture: These engines are rebuilt by the factory or
factory certified shop all the way back to like brand new. Lots of new
parts, fits and clearances now are like factory new, nothing modified or
regound except as official approved engine modifications for improved
engine life or performance. No oversize bearings, pistons or cylinder
barrels ( Aircraft engines could typically go .015 oversize before
haveing to replace the barrel but factory re-man brings it back to
stock.) This is as good as it gets, and a brand new engine is no better.
Comes with the same warranty as a factory new engine. And the price
reflects it.
So be careful of what you buy, and know what you are buying. No
surprises. There is the old saying of "You get what you pay for". Well,
with engines it's so true. But the main thing is, don't pay for what you
are not getting. And if you can afford to pay for bringing everything up
to new specs, do it. Life will be sweeter if you do.
Regards,
John Rodgers
88 GL Driver
ROBERT DONALDS wrote:
>What's the difference between rebuilding and reassembling
>MEASURING and restoring the clearances
>you can't rebuild an engine without the proper micrometers
>you can only put it back together
>
>the other critical tool is experiance
>
>Boston Bob
>militant engine rebuilder
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>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Mark Seifert" <theburnvictims@HOTMAIL.COM>
>To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
>Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 12:52 AM
>Subject: Re: Tools for engine overhaul on 85 waterboxer
>
>
>
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>>When I rebuilt my 2.1 waterboxer, I never needed any special tools. I used
>>
>>
>a
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>
>>slide hammer to pull the wrist pins out. I pulled the clips out of the
>>
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>side
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>>facing the hole, and left the other clips in. Then i put the threaded part
>>of the slide hammer through with a nut on the end, and the pins came out
>>with a little effort. I didnt have to use the special reamer tool or
>>anything like that. Make sure you have some small circlip pliers to fit
>>through that hole. This was the most difficult part for me. I found that
>>
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>the
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>>pistons were easier to work with if the sleeves were removed. That's why
>>putting them back in was more difficult. And you have to be very careful
>>
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>not
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>>to let the rings pop out. I had to put all my cylinders in twice because
>>
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>of
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>>this mistake. You have to put the rear cylinders in first (closest to
>>flywheel), as the front cylinder will block the hole. So if the rings pop
>>out of a rear cylinder, you have to take both off and start over. You're
>>supposed to use a special tool to hold the rods in place to get the pins
>>back in. The way I got around that was to put the motor on a bench, with
>>
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>the
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>>flywheel down. That way I could just turn the motor until the rod lined up
>>with the hole. If you have rebuilt air cooled motors, then I'm sure you
>>know about pressing the gears off the crankshaft and heating them to go
>>
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>back
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>>on. That was fun. Other than that, I cant think of anything else besides a
>>dial indicator to check end play. Everyone has told me not to use the
>>click-type torque wrench on the heads. Not sure exactly why, but they
>>
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>preach
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>>it, so I listened. I bought a cheapo pointer-syle for $11. Those dont seem
>>very accurate, but I dont think it has to be exactly 37 lbs anyway. Cant
>>think of anything else right now. This is basically an air-cooled vw motor
>>with a water jacket, so the only BIG difference is the pistons/sleeves. I
>>would recommend NOT buying special tools. If someone will let you borrow
>>them, it would probably be easier but...anyway, Hope this helps.
>>-Mark
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>From: Don <Williams@BIOL.WWU.EDU>
>>>Reply-To: Don <Williams@BIOL.WWU.EDU>
>>>To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>>>Subject: Tools for engine overhaul on 85 waterboxer
>>>Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 11:05:45 -0700
>>>
>>>I need to overhaul my new (to me) 85 Westfalia with the standard
>>>waterboxer engine. I need the specialized tools that are required to
>>>remove/replace pistons and sleeves and any other specialized tools
>>>(removing circlips and piston pins, it looks impossible through that
>>>little hole. . Are there others besides the piston/sleeves issue??
>>>How can I make/borrow/buy them. I have overhauled air-cooled engines
>>>many times---this is a whole new trip for me. I haven't been to the
>>>dealer yet, but this could cost me a small fortune just for the tools??
>>>Thanks for any help you can give me.
>>>Don
>>>
>>>
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