Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 11:10:31 -0700
Reply-To: Doug in Calif <vanagon@ASTOUND.NET>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Doug in Calif <vanagon@ASTOUND.NET>
Subject: Re: Vanagon burned to the ground ( long reply)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Mark,
Your post brings cringes down my spine as I think about all the work you
invested. I too have invested (too much) into my syncro westy conversion. I
think if I watched it go up in flames I would have a heart attack on the
sidewalk. If I am out off roading and roll it sideways down a hill from my
bad driving, that's different.
I am truly sorry for your loss. I hope you find another newer and better
vanagon and continue the interest. These are fantastic vehicles and they are
still around in large numbers and many folks are letting them go for not too
much money these days. Since you are mechanical and already know how to
rebuild a wbx engine I hope you find an incredible deal.
I know it may be tough but if you have a picture you can post for the rest
of us it may indeed get some folks to go out and take a hard look at the
fuel system.
I have posted about this very topic to the group to try to get a collective
interest gathering about what steps can be taken to prevent this
catastrophic event from happening to our loved vanagons, and what we can do
if it does happen.
So far here's what I believe are some of the best measures:
1) carry a good fire extinguisher.
I would like to know where I can buy a HALON fire extinguisher CHEAP.
2) Check your fuel lines. get up close and personal. Seems a good way would
be to turn on the ignition but don't start and go to every section and push
it around a bit to see if you can get a leak or break in the line.
3) Get an early METAL deck lid for the back engine cover. This has been
talked about. What I would like to know is what can a handyman like myself
do? What gauge sheet metal would work if I just cut a piece and lay it
under the mat on the rear deck? Is there a product we could use UNDER the
lid? space shuttle tiles? wonder board? hardy backer cement board? sheet
metal?
4) what about installing a high temp alarm or smoke alarm in the engine
compartment?
5) What are the culprits in the fuel system? I personally only seen two
places leak
one was the plastic fitting at the firewall where the plastic line
connects. Other place was the short lines from the fuel
rails to the injectors themselves, these have been known to go bad and leak
on air cooled engines for decades. There is a crimp on connector that can be
ground
off and the hose CAN be replaced without replacing the fuel injector itself.
These should be checked regularly.
6) I would really like an "early alert system" of some kind, because I
believe if there is a fuel leak it will dump LOTS of fuel all over the
engine and back of the vehicle in NO TIME. once its all over one spark and
the whole underside is a blaze. if it takes you a minute to figure out your
bus is on fire. that's a minute that is HUGE.
Is it possible to detect the drop in fuel pressure or large consumption of
fuel somehow and ALARM it?
Is there such a thing as a "raw gas / fuel detector" ?
The deck lid is made of fiberglass polyester resin and I imagine does not
last very long in an engine fire. It is also responsible for the ENTIRE van
going up instead of what may be a salvageable vehicle. I think a simple
piece of 3/8 hardy backer concrete tile board alone on the top of the rear
deck would offer some protection. perhaps a sheet of 22 gauge sheet metal
under it as
well.
There are some new materials in wood stoves today that are very light and
will not burn. Its a product called "vermiculite" "ver-mic-u-lite" it looks
somewhat like particle board but will absolutely not burn under the highest
heat. It is very light. It is currently being used in wood stoves to create
a "super hot fire" by insulating the fire box area and allows the stove to
burn much cleaner.
A product like this installed in place of the "waffle" foam under the lid
may save a van from torching up inside.
Mark, again I am soo sorry to hear about your van. I hope there is another
one in your future.
Doug
----- Original Message -----
From: "mark seifert" <ubervanagon1@HOTMAIL.COM>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Sunday, August 01, 2004 11:31 PM
Subject: Vanagon burned to the ground
> My Vanagon had an engine fire earlier this week, and there was nothing I
> could do
> but watch it burn away. It was a pretty surreal experience and I think I'm
> still in shock. It's kind of a relief I guess. All those hours and money
> that went into it...now I don't have to worry about it anymore. My
headache
> is gone. It was a pretty nice van though, and I just rebuilt the engine
down
> to the crankshaft a few months ago. And as some of you know, I had been
> spending
> many hours trying to work out the running problems since then.
>
> Although the firefighters showed up quickly, there was nothing they could
do
> to save it. The interior was melted all the way to the front seats, the
rear
> tires melted, the tail lights pretty much turned to liquid, and just about
> all the
> plastic on the rear of the van was gone. The steering wheel and the
> windshield were
> charred. The instrument cluster was blackened so badly you couldn't read
the
> speedometer.
>
> I went to the impound yard today to get everything that was salvageable
> before I signed the van over to them. There wasn't much. All my spare
parts
> under the rear seat were burned, including a spare ECU, fuel pump, air
flow
> meter, coil, water pump, and some other things. My cd changer under the
> front seat was soaked with water, and all my maps (a huge collection) in
the
> glove
> box were also soaked.
>
> It's been stated before how important it is to not only replace old fuel
> lines, but make sure all the clamps are tight. I'm pretty sure that's how
> this fire started. I probably missed one of those clamps, and it popped
off.
> Check those fuel lines, and DOUBLE-check your clamps.
> They say it's also a good idea to carry a fire extinguisher, just in case.
> But a fire
> extinguisher wouldn't have helped me even if I had one. I didn't realize
the
> engine was on fire until it died at a stop sign, and I got out and saw
> flames
> coming up from under the rear hatch. I couldn't have opened it without
> burning myself severely. It was out of control before I knew it.
>
> This just goes to show how meaningless our posessions really are. They can
> self-destruct at anytime, burn away right before our eyes, but we still
> remain the same.
> We move on with our lives. I have to ride my bike to work now for a while,
> since the Vanagon was my only vehicle. Of course I didn't have insurance,
so
> I guess I'll just have to start saving up to buy another one.
>
> Good luck to all of you, and thanks for all the help you've given me!
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Don't just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search!
> http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/
