Date:         Tue, 31 Aug 2004 15:03:18 -0600
Reply-To:     bhs73@SPYMAC.COM
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Mark Edwards <bhs73@SPYMAC.COM>
Subject:      Re: emission ethics
In-Reply-To:  <vanagon%2004083115251170@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>

>in other words, the most effective immediate way to cope with pollution
>and the now permanently decreasing level of petroleum production is
>reducing population. this will happen gracefully, or catastrophically,
>but is going to happen as the petroleum age comes to an end within the
>next 40 - 50 years.

So babies come from Saudia Arabia? I thought it was the Stork :-)

Its a difficult  stretch to connect population to oil. Less time driving
means more time at home, means more time for..... well, you get the
picture.

The world is not overcrowded, just a poorly planned distribution of
people. <g>

Crude production is decreasing because we are running out of it. Its
decreasing because its being used as a political and monetary club by
those who are perceived to be the only people that have it. It a
fascinating twist to use that hypothesis that we can control population
with oil production :-)

I don't believe we will survive long enough get past the petroleum age.
Crude is a politcial tool, its a environmentalist weapon, its a carrot,
and its far to deeply imbedded into our world society. Removing it, or
getting people to give it up will fail as badly as new coke, and the
metric system in the US :) Our best bet is a  total collapse of
civilization, and then the wisdom to rebuild it properly.

<finally, vanagon content>

>>If i were still living in Atlanta, I'd probably have to give up the
>>Vanagon--it's last test was on the verge of not passing.  I'd never do
>>anything to circumvent the testing though--Atlanta has filthy air and
>>I don't think i'd be happy contributing to it.


In Utah, if your vehicle fails the emissions test, there is a maximum
amount of cash you are required to spend to get it to pass. If your
repairs exceed that amount, you get a waiver, even if it still fails. Its
an annual thing, and not very cost effective, but its a way around it.
Five years ago, the amount required on my 1984 Chevette was $300. I would
imagine a vanagon would be even less.

Do other states alllow this kind of waiver option?

>>
>>  No
>>counties in Iowa currently test for vehicle emissions but I don't know
>>how long that will continue to be the case.  The fact is that driving
>>it adds to the net effect of pollution even though I don't live in a
>>place with dirty air.

The increasing majority of cars have computers and check engine lights
that do the job of monitoring emissions. Assuming that everyone is not
riding around with the Check Engine light on, those cars are passing
emissions standards, so when they come to your Iowa town demanding to
charge you a fee every year to go in and show that your car is not putting
out excessive emissions, turn it around and demand numbers on how many
vehicles are actually failing the test in the first place, and wonder why
they are, if the computer is working. Emissions testing  of those type
vehicles is a terrible waste of time and money, a cash cow for the test
stations, and a tool teh government uses to beat us over the head with in
November. We need emissions controls, but they have to be in place every
day, not just one day per year. That is what the computer controls give
us, only we still have to fork over $30+ each year, or every two years as
well.

Mark