Date:         Thu, 30 Sep 2004 10:56:32 -0600
Reply-To:     don spence <dspence@OANET.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         don spence <dspence@OANET.COM>
Subject:      Re: Oil Pan Heater (immersion vs. stickon)
In-Reply-To:  <200409300359.i8U3x6L28799@moe.oanet.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed

Gnarlie
I don't know where you live but up here in the Great White North engine
heaters were de rigeur prior to global warming.  The improvements in
engine management technology (FI) and the warmer winters have meant I
haven't plugged in for over 10 years. Except for the Vanagon, which is
not often used in the winter.   We just don't get those prolonged
periods of -40 (C or F, take your pick as they are the same at that
temp)

Grampa used to say... "The best thing going for starting in winter is
park it on the manure pile and throw a blanket over the engine". Worked
on grampa's Model T.

My vanagon has an under pan heater which works well.  The advantage
here is it warms the oil, thinning it and allowing lubrication as well
as removing resistance and stress on the oil pump. Allows a useful
cranking speed, instant oil flow to the bearings etc. The heat will
migrate to the upper engine as well. Usually takes 2 hours. Set a timer
if you need it in the morning.
I used a dipstick oil heater on a 68 beetle many years ago. It started
but a beetle without a working gas heater was no match for a prairie
winter.

Engine block heaters are a bitch to install in a cramped engine
compartment as the go in a frost plug hole which is usually tucked
under a manifold etc.  They will heat the coolant that comes in contact
with the element and again the heat will migrate to the rest of the
engine over time. They can be left plugged in indefinitely. Only caveat
is the cost of electricity.

The best system and easiest to install is a circulating  in line heater
that you insert into a rad hose. These little units heat the coolant
and thermo pump it around the block there by warming the entire engine
block. Unfortunately neither the immersion nor the circulating heaters
have a direct impact on the oil in the sump.

Of course you can park it in a heated garage there by inviting early
rust outs... but that's another discussion.
Cheers


On Wednesday, September 29, 2004, at 10:00 PM, Automatic digest
processor wrote:

> Date:    Wed, 29 Sep 2004 20:28:40 -0600
> From:    Gnarlodious <gnarlodious@EARTHLINK.NET>
> Subject: Re: Oil Pan Heater (immersion vs. stickon)
>
> Several claims here are a little hard to believe, I'll respond to them
> itemwise.
>
>> Our oil pan heaters are thin, flexible heating pads that are
>> permanently
>> bonded to the oil pan.
>> The heater has the special adhesive already on it, by simply peeling
>> of the
>> protective backing and
>> pressing the  heater firmly in place on a clean, flat surface, the
>> heater is
>> ready to be used.
> My experience is that oil combined with heat wreaks havoc on the
> stickum.
> Once the glue separates from direct contact heat transfer is
> drastically
> slowed. And if a sharp object tears your heatpad it's dangerous when
> wet.
>
> They do work well when stuck to a battery though.
>
>> No special tools or skills are required. Everything for a complete
>> installation is included with each heater.
> I admit, installing the immersion heater is a bitch. This would work
> for
> stopgap.
>
>> An Oil Pan Heater is far superior to a block heater and more
>> efficient.
> Not true at all. The pad I used was only 50 watts and in cold weather
> (0degF) could do no more than heat the oil a little. The only
> advantage to
> the pad is you could leave it on all night, which you can't really do
> with
> an immersion heater. But maybe they expect you to leave it on all the
> time.
>
>> A block heater only "warms" a part of the engine.
> But the important part, the liquid. And fast, at 400 watts. You can
> hear the
> heater popping and crackling in there so you know it's working. The
> warm
> liquid rises up to the combustion chamber where it does the most good.
> Plus, your heater works a lot sooner.
>
>> An Oil Pan Heater "heats" the complete engine starting at the bottom.
> But this process takes hours, and only under ideal conditions. For
> example,
> if it's windy you lose the heat as fast as it's generated because it's
> trying to move outside in.
>
>> The hot oil heats the crankshaft,
>>  which in turn heats the connecting rods, pistons and cylinder
>> heads. Remember "heat" rises.
> When you need to start you engine in 20 minutes you don't need a warm
> crankshaft, you need a warm combustion chamber.
>
>> We recommend the model 9.0 for your VW Vanagon.
> OK, I see 125 watts in a 3 inch diameter stickon. I still say the
> immersion
> heater is vastly superior but the stickon heater would be good for
> certain
> applications, such as big trucks with high ground clearance.
>
>> The price of the model 9.0 is $59.00.00 Cdn. Dlrs Shipping charges are
>> included in price.
> Woah, expensive too! what's that in $US?
>
>> Web site http://www.padheaters.com/