Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:21:48 -0800
Reply-To: TinkerMan <tinkerman007@YAHOO.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: TinkerMan <tinkerman007@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: Re: Cabin Heat / Aux Heating / Propane Heater/ camping heater /
pics
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Forgot a question ot two...:-)
1. Do you have any more good pictures of your design?
2. Up-to-date feedback after using this unit more in
the field (especially regarding it's BTU output)?
cheers, T-man
--- "T.M." <tinkerman007@YAHOO.COM> wrote:
> Doug,
>
> This is the most BRILLIANT DIY idea I've ever seen
> for heating the
> vangon!!! And your idea of placing it in the body
> cavity is also superb!
> At first I was scared about a DIY heater project
> involving propane, but
> after carefully reading your description and seeing
> your clear pictures I
> concluded that you have a great idea. I wonder why
> it hasn't drawn much
> more attention (probably because it's a highly
> technical project with some
> underlying danger if you don't do things right, but
> IMO you have included
> many safety features that make it quite a safe
> solution).
>
> Also, your adherance to relatively easily available
> parts and technologies
> make it quite a feasible project for any relatively
> capable DIY'er.
> Now to some practical questions:
>
> 1. How much BTU do you estimate those two mantels
> put out (or propane
> consumption per hour, which can give an estimation
> of BTU).
>
> 2. Since you said it's a little underpowered, don't
> you think it could be
> expanded with a few more mantles or even by using
> more powerful compact
> portable stove burners?
>
> 3. From what material is the electrical box made of,
> and which welding
> technology did you use?
>
> 4. Although you say the vented combustion products
> are barely hot ("You
> can just barely sense a slight temp change of air at
> the outlet") wouldn't
> it be risky using a plastic CPU fan for the task in
> case the outgasses got
> hotter and melted the fan? BTW, your design takes
> care of that too,
> because as you said the mantles would go out if the
> fan stopped and then
> the thermocouple would shut the propane supply.
>
> 5. Wouldn't it be safer to add an overheating
> shutoff function? That would
> be difficult IMO, as I don't know of any overheating
> shutoff valve
> available (the thermocouple is an "underheating"
> shutoff valve). The only
> way I can think of is an electronic thermoswitch
> coupled with an
> electrical gas valve (which I don't think is an
> available product). So at
> least a electronic thermoswitch coupled with a
> warning buzzer to alert you
> to turn of this heater before it gets out of
> control...
>
> Let me salute you for a great idea!...
>
> cheers, TM
>
> On Tue, 16 Nov 2004 15:44:50 -0800, Doug in Calif
> <vanagon@ASTOUND.NET>
> wrote:
>
> >Well Volks,
> >Especially those of you who are doing the winter
> camping thing and are
> dealing with the COLD.
> >Here is a heating idea that I have put together for
> my bus, that I would
> like to share with the group, especially those of
> you who typically think
> out of the box and design your own solutions. This
> is one of the greatest
> values of the list in my opinion. I am constantly
> getting fantastic ideas
> from the group.
> >I have finally completed another one of my Syncro
> GL to westy conversion
> projects.
> >The completely "HOME GROWN Primus Lantern mantle
> fresh air heater". "Ta-
> da!"
> >
> >Some of you will surely say I have too much time on
> my hands which I wish
> was the case. Rather, I really really enjoy and get
> a great deal of
> accomplishment from projects like these.
> >I think it is a shame there are not more "fresh
> air" heating options for
> the vanagon.
> >I wanted a heater that would completely vent intake
> and exhaust air to
> the outside of the van and would have zero emissions
> and oxygen depletion
> inside the van.
> >I wanted a heater I could sleep right next to with
> absolutely zero worry
> that I may wake up "dead" from depleted oxygen or
> build up of carbon
> monoxide.
> >I have looked at pretty much everything out there
> and the Propex is the
> one I really like but its not cheap and I could not
> install it where I
> installed this one in the side body cavity.
> >I have done some initial tests now with my
> completed project and I feel I
> achieved what I wanted.
> >
> >By using two Primus lantern mantles re-jetted for
> the low 1 psi pressure
> of the regulated westy tank I am able to generate a
> decent amount of heat
> for the
> >rear sleeping area of my syncro. I started with a
> basic ten dollar
> electrical box from my local yard birds, seal welded
> in eight 3/4 inch
> metal tubes to act as a fresh air heat exchanger.
> >I used two hot water heater copper flex lines to
> vent intake and exhaust
> air to the side air duct at the rear of the van. I
> am using a thermocouple
> from a parted out westy fridge to shut off the
> propane in the event the
> mantles should go out. Wood stove ceramic glass for
> a window in the face,
> wood stove door seal rope for the seal of the face.
> I made a hinged cover
> to hide the light from the lamps. 4 inch 107 cfm
> 12vt box fan draws 1/2 an
> amp for the main blower, 10ohmm resistor to gives
> the fan 2 speeds, a
> thermal 160 degree snap switch mounted on the top of
> the heater box cycles
> the blower fan on and off. Webber bbq Pizo
> ignighter lights the first
> mantle and once lit, the 2nd mantle will light from
> it. I found out the
> hard way that the unit would not "draft" as it did
> on the bench test, once
> I had installed it in the van, the box filled up
> with propane to the level
> of the pizo before igniting, my heart is still
> recovering from that event.
> I ended up installing a small 1inch CPU fan to the
> far end of the exhaust
> run which I ran all the way to the top of the air
> intake behind the
> plastic louver intake. You can just barely sense a
> slight temp change of
> air at the outlet. Which means that most of the heat
> from the mantles is
> being extracted by the heater. Installing the
> combustion fan on the
> exhaust side and drawing a "vacuum" on the heater
> box is the best way to
> install a combustion blower because any leakage will
> draw air into the box
> and exhaust it. If you install the combustion blower
> on the intake and
> create a pressure to push the air, any leaks will
> come into the van. I
> believe I have a good seal as with the blower off
> the mantles use up all
> the air quickly and go out.
> >
> >I used bubble foil behind the heater and around the
> heater to create a
> proper air duct for the blower fan to push the air
> through the heater. I
> used fiberglass header wrap on the back of the
> heater box itself as it
> gets pretty warm, also a small section of the body
> metal behind the heater
> where its a bit close. My testing running the heater
> for long periods show
> only a small warming of a few degrees of the body
> metal when you feel it
> from the outside, hardly even noticeable by feel.
> >
> >The amount of heat is not huge, I do not think you
> could heat the whole
> van effectively unless you had really good
> insulation and ran the heater
> for a long time. It does heat up the back sleeping
> area pretty well and it
> uses a very small amount of battery and propane. I
> am
=== message truncated ===
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