Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2005 01:43:59 -0400
Reply-To: The Bus Depot <vanagon@BUSDEPOT.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: The Bus Depot <vanagon@BUSDEPOT.COM>
Subject: Re: Difference between Sachs, Luk HD, Luk Premium?
In-Reply-To: <61be44865f75236f41201873ae1a958e@mac.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> Is there $80 difference between Sachs and Luk clutch kits?
> I have tree trunk legs, but my wife doesn't - is the HD much
> harder to depress than the Sachs?
Actually, the difference isn't $80 to begin with. To go from Sachs to the
cheapest Luk is only $25. To go from that one to their upgraded version is
another $50.
I have outlined this here before, but since it's been a while maybe it's
worth a repeat...
Both Sachs and LuK are original-equipment suppliers to VW, so they both are
equally "pedigreed.". However, the Sachs kit ($125) is what is most commonly
found in the U.S. aftermarket, because LuK is not nearly as well known (or
as widely available) in the U.S. as it is in Europe. Sachs manufactures the
parts in their kit in Germany, Mexico, and Canada, so what is in the kit you
get may vary over time. Thousands of people use their kits with no problem.
However there have been many reports on the Vanagon list of "clutch chatter"
with the Sachs kits. It is impossible to say whether the Sachs kits have a
tendancy toward this, because other factors may be in play here. For
example, a worn motor mount or an unevenly surfaced flywheel could be the
culprit rather than the Sachs kit. Since there are more Sachs kits "out in
the field" than LuK kits, it follows that if someone DOES have a "clutch
chatter" problem (whether or not it was caused by the clutch itself), the
odds are that he will happen to have a Sachs kit in his Vanagon. So are all
(or even most) "clutch chatter" problems due to the Sachs kit? I doubt it.
Most are probably due to other external variables. Many people use Sachs
kits and never have a problem.
On the other hand, of all the clutch kits we've sold (and we probably sell
more Vanagon clutch kits than anyone), I simply don't hear of clutch chatter
problems with LuK kits. Maybe it's because there are fewer out there. On the
other hand, we've sold hundreds of them over the years, not just a handful.
You'd think that at least a few people who experienced clutch chatter would
have had a Luk kit in ther Vanagon. So the other possibility is that the
LuK kits have a reduced tendancy toward clutch chatter. Does this make the
LuK worth a couple more bucks? Perhaps, even if only for the "peace of
mind."
LuK offers two kits, one for $150 and one for $200. Their $150 kit is their
competiton for the $125 Sachs kit. In all the LuK kits I've seen, the disk
and pressure plate have been German made (which has not always been the case
with the Sachs). I have seen a few come through with Brazilian throwout
bearings, but they were generally OEM VW and I have never had any problem
with them. Of course this could change; multinational manufacturers open
new factories all the time. (Many of the genuine VW ones come from Hungary,
for example.) But from what I've seen, the LuK kits are more consistently
German than the Sachs kits are. Not that this automatically makes them
better. (For example, the Hungarian VW ones seem to be excellent.) But I
mention it because it may matter to the
"I-don't-want-anything-on-my-Vanagon-that-isn't-German" crowd.
The $200 LuK kit (which is the one we call "heavy duty") is actually the one
that was factory-installed on all mid 1989 thru 91 Vanagons, though it fits
all years. (This kit has been referred to as a "Syncro" clutch kit by others
in the archives, but in fact it was used during the last couple years of
production on ALL Vanagons, Syncro or not.) On these, the pressure plate
was slightly redesigned to require a bit less pedal travel to engage the
clutch, actually making the clutch a bit easier to operate. Also it visually
appears to be a bit more robust than the other two. It is worth noting that
Sachs does not offer an equivalent to this kit in the U.S. They once did,
but they they stopped selling it in the U.S. and now sell their standard
$125 kit for all Vanagons. So this kit is only available from LuK. (And even
from them, I have to order it specially, as LuK will also send their
standard kit in its place you aren't very specific about what you're looking
for.)
Which would I buy for my own Vanagon? At minimum I'd kick in the extra $25
for the cheaper Luk, if only for the peace of mind of knowing that it's
never been blamed (legitimately or not) for clutch chatter. But frankly, I'd
buy the $200 one, because for the another $50, versus the hassle of
replacing a clutch, it's not worth even considering cutting corners. I'm a
pretty frugal person, and those who have been on the list a while know that
I don't hesitate to recommend a cheaper part if I think it's a better value.
But replacing a clutch is major pain in the neck, and not one that's worth
doing any more often than absolutely necessary. To me, on a job this big
(and this expensive, if you're paying a mechanic for the labor), cutting
corners on the part is being penny-wise and pound-foolish.
So that's my long-winded $0.02.
- Ron Salmon
The Bus Depot, Inc.
www.busdepot.com
(215) 234-VWVW
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Toll-Free for Orders by PART # : 1-866-BUS-DEPOT
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