Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 09:01:51 -0400
Reply-To: Christopher Gronski <gronski@GMAIL.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Christopher Gronski <gronski@GMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: Low Mileage Syncro Westy for $6,000?
In-Reply-To: <00a101c58955$0eb7f710$8f6f0a0a@W05560>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Jim,
I started this thread, its my van. I don't feel I ever ranted or
slandered PTH... look through the complete thread. The closest I could
find was when I said I was a "bit insulted by the offer of $6,000".
That's it.
If you look at my correspondence to them I follow up by asking if they
had made and error in their valuation (like say omitting the 1 in
front of the 6). When they reconfirmed the price I did indeed reply
with a complaint. I did not say they were crooks, I did not say the
lied, I simply indicated they did not provide the service that they
advertised on their website (indeed "false advertising is an offense
under the law - but I never even accused them of that... I just
indicated they did not do what they promised):
"Your website says "Click here to determine the value of your vehicle"
and "Click the link above or to the right to get a FREE valuation of
your vehicle!" it does not say click here to get a list of current
bidders. I am not going to start this process by revealing what I
think it is worth... that is not a valuation."
I do not think asking someone "What is the absolute minimum you are
willing to part with the vehicle for?" constitutes a valuation and I
feel my complaint was legitimate. Though admittedly sarcastic, I was
quite serious when I told them that
"I will gladly take as many syncro westies as you can provide in
similar condition at that price". If they are truly selling vans
through to buyers in any kind of volume at these prices I would have
been their best customer.
Which brings me to not being their customer, or not being serious
about selling "Click here to determine the value of your vehicle" and
"Click the link above or to the right to get a FREE valuation of your
vehicle!", would appear to indicate that they welcome inquiries.
In summary to your list Jon:
1) you didn't want to sell your van anyway - I never indicated to them
that I wanted to sell, I asked for an valuation.
2) They didn't offer to buy your van directly anyway, they said they
had a BUYER willing to pay $6k. - I did not ask what their list of
buyers would pay, I asked for a valuation.
3) If they were buying it themselves they are still only going to
offer what they feel they can buy it for and collect some fair profit
for in resale after "cleaning it up" - I did not ask what they would
buy it for (and without seeing the van the only thing they had to go
by was me indicating the van was in "excellent" condition), I asked
for a valuation.
My "complaint" is that they did not do a valuation pure and simple.
Please tell me where I went wrong here. Perhaps I did say something
out of line and I did not catch it as I re read this thread. But all I
think I have done is post the actual correspondence of my dealings
with this company. Do I share some of the sentiments of people who
replied to my post? Of course I do but this list is about sharing our
experiences be they adventures, mechanical expertise, vendor
experiences, or whatever. I stand by my post, and I still believe my
van is worth more than $6,000 US.
Chris
On 7/15/05, Jon Brown <jbrown510@gmail.com> wrote:
> I can't beleive how often and how many times we all have to have this
> conversation about the "value" of our vanagons...
>
> I'm bothered by the ranting, complaining and outright slandering of Poptop
> Heaven. I know NOTHING about them, other than having noticed them off the
> freeway one day driving in that area. (funny how a vanagon anywhere catches
> out eyes, isn't it). Regardless they OBVIOUSLY do a good bussiness as they
> sell a lot of vanagons and euorvans and I have yet to notice a single
> complaint here or elsewhere from any of there actual customers.
>
> Ranting/Complaining/slandering them because they didn't offer you enough for
> your highly customized vans is, IMHO, rude and inappropriate. 1) you didn't
> want to sell your van anyway. 2) They didn't offer to buy your van directly
> anyway, they said they had a BUYER willing to pay $6k. That means they have
> a buyer that said "if you can get me a syncro westy for $6k I'll buy it".
> That's the rality of who thier list of buyers is. 3) If they were buying it
> themselves they are still only going to offer what they feel they can buy it
> for and collect some fair profit for in resale after "cleaning it up". Given
> the number of vans they sell I trust they have a good handle on what that
> typically is. Further, they are certinally going to be somewhat
> conservative on anything they make an offer on sight unseen.
>
> Yes, perhaps someone would pay 15k for your highly modififed van, but who is
> that customer and does Poptop Heaven have them as a customer base? Probably
> not. Poptop Heaven would have to pay 12k? 15k? 20k? for your van and then
> have to sit on it for a year waiting for the "right" customer to come along
> and pay for all the mods... that's not thier bussiness. You can't fault a
> bussiness for running thier bussiness as they see most fit!
>
> Put your van up on ebay if you want to sell it and sell it to the highest
> bidder in the country... then let us all know what you get for it.
>
> The other thing everyone ought to rememember is this. The people that LOVE
> this highly modified vans.... have them. When I bought my syncro westy it
> was stock with a blown motor... I knew I wanted an engine conversion, but
> it wasn't until AFTER getting it that I starting adding awnings, a
> decoupler, SA Brakes, etc... etc.... finding someone to BUY a customized
> van for "accumulated value" is much harder than finding someone to buy a
> stock van that they'll later slowly turn into thier own little 20k dollar
> project.
>
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