Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 21:56:06 -0400
Reply-To: Richard Golen <rgolen@UMASSD.EDU>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Richard Golen <rgolen@UMASSD.EDU>
Subject: Re: Vanagon & Eurovan - community helping community
In-Reply-To: <000c01c5a909$7963ca70$8f9fd646@t41>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
Larry,
You have to understand, for the most part subscribers to lists like
the Vanagon list are "enthusiasts" not run of the mill
drivers/owners. In 1993 I purchased a Eurovan Multivan. Shortly
thereafter I joined the "orginal" Vanagon list - pre-
aircooled-split, etc"...it took the longest time for the Vanagon and
other Type 2 list members to even recognize the Eurovan as a VW van
and include me in the "conversation"...even LiMBO took a while to
finally admit the Eurovan was a VW van!!
Currently I own a 1987 Westy because the Eurovan burned up five years
ago as a result of a bad design on a fuel injection hose. Its funny,
when I drove the Eurovan, very few VW van T1, T2 and T3 owners would
wave, beep, etc....then again I got few waves from other Eurovan
owners. In the 87 Westy I get few waves from Eurovan owners, but I
also run across Vanagon owners who think I'm strange when I wave or
beep at them. Recently I saw a Vanagon about 1/2 mile down the
interstate...I sped up (ok...went from 65 to 70 mph) and eventually
caught up to the other Vanagon. I pulled in behind, flashed my
lights, moved left and pulled aside. I beeped and waved...the other
Vanagon driver looked at me and flipped me off! At least I had never
been flipped off by a EuroVan owner! ;-)
Its not just van owners that I've experienced this "lack of
enthusiasm" with. I own a 1956 Beetle as well as a 1998 New Beetle.
On both the Vintage VW list and the New Beetle list there have been
the same "discussions"...old beetle owners not waving or beeping at
New Beetles and vice versa. When I drive the 56 Beetle, I get few
waves from New Beetle owners...when I drive my New Beetle and wave at
most old beetle owners, I either get ignored or get a glaring look as
if I was some sort of "poser"...
I've experienced the same thing when I had a 1970 BMW 2002 ti (NOT
TII)...newer Bimmer owners (read mid-80s yuppie-types) didn't even
have a clue what a 2002 was....same thing when I had a 911 SC....most
of the Porsche owners I ran into were the "gold chain" types who
bought a Porsche as a status symbol (these were the type of folks who
couldn't drive the 911 to save their butts!). What a difference 10 or
15 years made with Porsches...I had a 356 in the late 60-s early 70's
and when you encountered a 356, 911 or even 914 on the road - lights
flashed, hands waved from the top of the steering wheel...but by the
late 80s most of that disappeared...
Sorry to say folks, not every VW owner is as passionate about his/her
Vanagon/Type 2/Beetle/New Beetle, etc..etc.. as members on this
list....it just is what it is...
Ric
At 08:10 PM 8/24/2005, Larry Chase wrote:
>Cross list post ... Vanagon.com & EV_update
>
>To: EV-Update folks,
>
>I recently posted a "distress call" for a stranded "Eurovan Traveller"
>to the Vanagon & EV lists.
>
>Several responses and offers of help came back from Vanagon folks, but
> very little from EV folks.
>
>I was a surprised and disappointed at the lack of help for one of your
>own.
>
>BTW .... current list membership count is:
>
>Vanagon.com = 904 members
>ev_update = 3627 members
>
>Those results prompted a discussion thread on the Vanagon list as to why
>EV owners don't seem to feel the same sense of Community (helping ea other)
>as perhaps Bus & Vanagon owners do.
>
>I don't intent this as a flame or put down to EV owners.
>
>I would like to understand your perspective.
>
>Why do you think EuroVan owners don't seem to be as motivated as other vw
>bus/van
>folks to help one another.
>
>Or am I off base and drawing the wrong conclusion?
>
>To me ... A VW VAN IS A VW VAN IS A VW VAN.
>
>I don't care if its air cooled, water cooled or beer cooled.
>
>We are all stuck with beautiful, but problematic vehicles.
>
>If someone is in need I'll try and help.
>
>I "clipped" a few of the comments from the vanagon group's discussion.
>
>- - -
>
>Personally I will help a "camper" regardless if splittie, bay, vanagon, or
>euro. However I have found that the vast majority of the euro crowd looks
>upon us all as "other" people.
>
>- - -
>
>To hell with those people, Larry. They won't even help one of their own, yet
>they act like a Vanagon was the result of a drunken night spent with a
>hooker
>from the wharfs.
>
>- - -
>
>I think the split is a result of the change in design philosophy. The
>Vanagon
>was still the same basic design from '80-- it was the last of the
>"traditional"
>Volkswagen designs. The EuroVan was just another minivan. It just doesn't
>have
>that same "thinking outside the box" look or feel that came with the old
>rear
>engine VWs, so it doesn't attract the same class of nuts.
>
>- - -
>
>Several of us approached the EV folks and started a general VW oriented
>conversation. They were not the least friendly. Would I help one of them if
>they had a problem? Yes. Would any of them help a Vanagon, Splittie or Bay
>bus
>owner in trouble? I seriously doubt they'd give us a second look or thought.
>
>- - -
>
>The average EVC owner/driver doesn't see themselves as part of the
>tradition,
>history or lineage that the Bus and Vanagon driver/owner/caretaker does.
>They
>just don't connect their EVC with the past history of VW campers or
>vehicles.
>I have to think that it is their loss, not ours. The sense of community
>among
>those driving Vanagons and Buses is lost to most of the EVC crowd.
>
>- - -
>
>I've met vanagon & bus folks like this too and I've met people in Ford
>campers
>who were nice folks. It's the people and not the van.
>
>- - -
>
>
>good road, good adventure
>
>larry chase
>
>www.roadhaus.com
>www.roadhaus.com/shops.html
>www.roadhaus.com/tires.html
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