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Date:         Mon, 21 Aug 2006 12:24:43 -0700
Reply-To:     David Marshall <mailinglist@FASTFORWARD.CA>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         David Marshall <mailinglist@FASTFORWARD.CA>
Subject:      Re: Supercharged Westy Vanagon
Comments: To: Malcolm Stebbins <mwstebbins@YAHOO.COM>
In-Reply-To:  <20060821181955.39617.qmail@web30215.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

Malcolm and the list It's all marketing! Horse Power sells cars and engine conversions - period! All the time I get people telling me they would never put a TDI into their Vanagon as it is a step down in power - why have a 90hp TDI when the original motor is 95hp. FORGET horsepower, it is torque that you are looking for. Of course, I know Malcolm knows this already... but for the rest of you it is all about torque.

Torque is rotational force, or the force necessary to keep your wheels rolling. Power is work over time, so having high horse power will make your van accelerate quickly, but if it has low torque, you not be able to maintain your speed going up a steep hill. This is why the old TiiCo engines are more zippy as they have circa 120hp, but the torque was circa 125ft.lbs which is only a few more than a standard 2.1L - on the flat they can accelerate more quickly than a wasserboxer, but real hill climbing they were marginally better. A stock TDI with 155 ft.lbs will go up a hill much faster than a stock vanagon even though it only has 90hp.

Also, for everyone, if you are going to go above 250ft.lbs of torque you better do some modification to your transmission. Both 3rd and 4th gears have to be changed to handle the extra torque and I know this from personal experience. My R-TDI powered Syncro Westfalia is on it's second transmission. The first one (newly rebuilt too) lasted 400km before I broke it. I figured I would cheap out a little and get 4th only changed as this is where I normally drive at. Well, going up a slow dirt road 10% grade at 60km/h in 3rd I killed my transmission with a small blip of the accelerator - zip - no more teeth on that cog! Torque of this engine is easily in excess of 350 ft.lbs at 2000 rpm and stock 3rd and 4th gears can not handle that much power. Once I get V2.0 of the software in there and I am in Vancouver next, I will get the engine dynoed to see how much power there actually is there. VNT-20 and PP764 nozzles with 1.7 bar of boost does make a crap load of power. A lot of guys on the TDIClub with this setup get over 200hp and 360ft.lbs of torque on this setup! Fuel economy is 9.5L/100km with is a little better than 30mpg.

Sorry, but a gasoline engine has it's limits in a Vanagon - ~25 mpg is about the best you are going to get and unless you turbo it or superchage it or get a really big one you will have not enough torque to make a conversion worth while in my opinion. Adding an aftermarket turbo or supercharge is crazy. If you want turbo power and a gasoline engine start with a Subaru or VW Turbo engine - safety in numbers - easy access to tech support and replacement parts is your friend.

David Marshall

On Mon, August 21, 2006 11:19, Malcolm Stebbins wrote: >> Below is an update on the Zetec kit with the supercharger upgrade: > > 1) On your Bostig web page please put the RPMs for the 148 Horsepower and > the 141 ft/lb torque. > Is this at 2,000 RPMs or 4,000 RPMs ???? I'd like to know. > > 2) I sure hope that the tranny can handle this power, I'm following what > you guys are doing, but > I'm to chicken to let my van be an early patient. m > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com >


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