Date:         Mon, 9 Oct 2006 16:07:52 -0700
Reply-To:     obeechi@RUNBOX.COM
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Mark C <obeechi@RUNBOX.COM>
Subject:      Re: Printing w HP1020 off a Deep Cycle Battery
In-Reply-To:  <000001c6eaf0$be7495c0$6400a8c0@MASTERPC>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

How do you determine that I need 160 amp hours?... 

I guess you're telling me that though my device is using 3.5 amps of household current, from the batteries perspective 33.5 amps are being used... but I don't ... oh wait.. you mean five hours of battery.. so 5*33=165 amp hours... would that be for allowing me to run for five hours continuous using this printer off the battery...  cause I'd only be using it for 20 minutes once every 2 to 4 weeks... at this point at least... 

Relay from between the alt and main battery... thats a new one to me.. is that to amplify the electric current... I thought the thinking here was that solenoids were better... I have relay between the main batter and the second battery.. and am going to switch it to a solenoid... should I use this same relay for between the alt and the main... 8 gauge wire is what I have between the inverter between the front seats and the second battery in the rear.. ... I couldn't seem to find loop connectors larger than 8 guage... (mine connectors are the yellow variety...) .. and you say get 6 guage from alt to main... what exactly do I have at this point (stock)... what about the potential of overheating the alternator (I have a subaru)... two batteries of 110 amp hours would bring me to 220 amp hours... but then I get mixed up on whether to join in series or in parallel, and then the whole subject comes up of 24 volts.. which really throws me in a loop cause I don't know what they're talking about... 
 
For those that are wondering.. I print lots of checks... and recently started using magnetic toner.. which wasn't available for my nicer, larger, and slower hp2600, so I had to buy this little hp1020, which just happens to fit a lot better in my vanagon... (and is real easy fit inside one of my thule spirits.. almost like it was made for it)... and since I'm now buying entirely blank checks.. to be able to walk into frys, buy a box of blanks and print the entire box before I even leave the parking lot (or better yet, while en route to someplace else...) is the goal here... I don't think I ever want preprinted checks again... change my phone number?, no problem, just go to frys, print more checks... and you're done.. no waiting for a delivery.. 

I did once order preprinted checks in bulk, 3000 checks.. had to buy that many to bring the cost down per check.. then didn't need any of the checks for a year.. then ended up using them again.. and for the remainder had to suffer using checks with an out of date wrong phone number... this is the history I don't want to repeat... Neat trick, being able to choice which histories you want to repeat... and deleting those you want to remove.. if you don't believe me just delete me... or repeat me and we can talk about this again.. 

From: Dennis Haynes <dhaynes@OPTONLINE.NET>
To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
Subject: Re: Printing w HP1020 off a Deep Cycle Battery

> Continue the math further. 402.5 watts/12 volts = 33.5 amps. And that
> printer has surges that are higher than that.
> 
> A deep cycle battery should be sized for at least a 5 hour discharge.  You
> need 160 A/H to properly support this printer. If the inverter is far from
> the battery, use 6 gauge wires. Did you leave the battery at PEP boys for a
> full day or overnight? If not it isn't properly charged. Battery charging
> takes time.
> 
> If the charging circuit is properly sized with a good relay, then running
> the engine will help. Fast idle for that load. Do you really need a laser
> jet printer while traveling?
> 
> As for dual inverters, yours did do the job. Avoid connecting to the main
> battery. Defeats the purpose of the second. Yes, it is possible to run it
> down even with the engine running. Upgrade the charging circuit to carry the
> load + battery charging. #8 or larger from alternator, to real relay, to
> battery will do wonders. Make sure the grounds are good. Often a separate
> ground from the alternator is really helpful to keep the regulator output
> high.
> 
> Dennis
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf Of
> Mark C
> Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2006 8:53 PM
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Subject: Printing w HP1020 off a Deep Cycle Battery
> 
> Hey I just charged my Marine House Battery of 110 amp hours at PepBoys...
> and my inverter is rated for 700 watts continuous and whose output is 115
> volts... and I have a small HP 1020 printer rated for 3.5 amps for household
> current... and the inverter is placed between the front seats and connected
> to the rear battery by 8 guage marine grade wire... so...
> 
> 115 volts * 3.5 amps = 402.5 watts
> 
> I ran a test, of ten pages printing off the printer, engine off, inverter
> connected to the Marine House Battery... and the led light of inverter would
> flicker towards red when powering up the printer then move towards green,
> and then while printing ten pages, would move towards red again... at least
> the inverter wasn't beeping this time (like before charging the deep
> cycle...)
> 
> I'm under the impression that it should be green on the inverter led, or at
> least not towards red at all... so is the inverter in need of an upgrade...
> or do I need to up the guage of the wire... or shorten its length (by making
> a more direct route)... or all of these things...
> 
> You know it would be nice if the inverter could be turned on by a remotely
> wired switch, like one attached to the rear kickpanel, or the front seat
> bases...
> 
> Also, I recently read that some devices, such as the Tivoli Satellite Radio
> that I have (which can be wired directly to the deep cycle battery), always
> have a small bit of current running through them to avoid hearing and
> crackle or pop when you turn them on... so this draw could be offset by a
> small solar panel...
> From: David Etter <detter@MAIL.AURACOM.COM>
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Subject: Re: Solar Panels behind Tinted Glass
> 
> > With just six watts at the very best of times (in theory) you are
> > getting 0.5 amps... just about enough to charge your flashlight
> > batteries; maybe, (read ahead).  Then again the sun would have to be
> > directly overhead and don't forget sitting in the sun on your
> > dash-top the temperature is going to skyrocket and any temp over 80 -
> > 90 degrees the panel's efficiency suffers.
> >         Best to pick up a panel that puts out 3.0+ amps (approx. 50
> > watts) and hide it in your roof luggage carrier.
> > With 12 volt solar Panels, watts and amps and volts are not an exact
> > formula, there is a lot of loss here. I have a 120 watt roof mounted
> > panel by Kyocera that maxs out at 7.0+ amps at 17 volts which is
> > where they operate, then with a controller cutting that to 13.8 volts
> > but you still only get the original 7.6 amps.
> >         Sorry but your six watter may actually only output about 1/4
> > amp, good for a set of Nimh camera batteries.
> >         david (dsl82westy)
> >
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> ~~~~~
> >
> > >I just bought a Sunsei solar panel that produces 6 watts... they
> > >have that diode so I don't have to worry about losing current at
> > >night... anyway... I don't really have good place to put it... right
> > >now its sitting on the passenger seat... so I'm wondering if I put
> > >it on behind the tinted side glass... how much energy will I not be
> > >producing.... has anyone fooled around with this??? thanks...
> > >
> > >And maybe I should have gotten the one that produces 18 watts...
> >
> 
> ----- End Original Message -----
> 

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