Date:         Mon, 23 Oct 2006 21:29:24 +0200
Reply-To:     Robin Oomkes <roomkes@ZONNET.NL>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Robin Oomkes <roomkes@ZONNET.NL>
Subject:      Re: VW Camper dreams
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=response

----- Original Message -----
From: "Loren Busch" <starwagen@GMAIL.COM>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2006 3:43 AM
Subject: Re: VW Camper dreams


> On 10/22/06, Mark Drillock <mdrillock@cox.net> wrote:
>>
>> That is exactly the top design I have been day dreaming about. A combo
>> hightop/poptop that gives added headroom all the time even when down.
>>
>
> Mark, this raises a question that has been in the back of my mind for some
> time.  Why don't we see (maybe should be past tense) more of these
> European
> van conversions here in the US and Canada?  We know of only three Dehlers
> here in NA (Karl says only six ever imported).  I've never heard of the
> Cathargo before or seen that type of high top.  A couple of possible
> reasons
> come to mind.  First, VW/Westfalia had the market tied up and they didn't
> want to compete.  That doesn't make sense because they were competing (and
> apparently with success) in VWs home market.  US regulations/laws
> regarding
> RVs? Shouldn't have been that hard to comply with, Westfalia did it.  Yes,
> I
> know the common wisdom is the camper equipment was designed in the US by
> Delta Six and some say actually made here, shipped there for assembly.
> But
> the virtual non-existence of Carthargo, Dehler, and Reimo conversions on
> this side of the the ocean seems a mystery I'd like to understand.
> Does anyone have any input on this subject?

Loren,

interesting point. VW campers were sold by Westfalia, not Volkswagen, in
Europe until 1988 - the ubiquitous Joker. Only after that year did VW decide
to take on marketing and sales by themselves, and paid Westfalia to do the
conversion. The Joker became the VW California, and VW continued this
formula in Europe until the arrival of the T5 in 2004, when VW booted out
Westfalia (now in the hands of Daimler Chrysler) completely and also brought
the camper conversion in house.

The fact that VW marketed Westfalia conversions in the US from the beginning
implies that it simply would not have been possible for a niche company such
as Westfalia to start their own US operations. And if Westfalia couldn't do
it, then Carthago or Dehler certainly wouldn't have been able to.

Even within Europe, it is difficult to buy a new Carthago or CS-mobile
(another
low volume, high-quality camper van manufacturer) in countries outside
Germany today, as this Dutchman can testify. The market and the network
simply don't exist. If you want one, you buy it from a German dealer (if
extant) or from the factory (more likely). Many of these companies have just
two outlets: the factory, and one dealer (on the opposite end of Germany).
For factory, read workshop...

Hope this sheds some light,

Robin

88 Westfalia Joker TD
02 BMW 320d touring
03 BMW R 1150 GS