Date:         Mon, 20 Nov 2006 21:50:47 -0500
Reply-To:     craig cowan <phishman068@GMAIL.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         craig cowan <phishman068@GMAIL.COM>
Subject:      Re: firing on 3 cylinders.
In-Reply-To:  <029501c70cbb$b0c310e0$3c0bfb48@mlcd4493e8f448>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

With the help you guys provided i was able to find the problem and
solve it, though im not entirely sure as to what i did to solve it. I
replaced the spark plugs, put on a new distributor cap, exchanged
wires between cylinders, and made sure i had the firing order set
properly. And with all that done, it now fires on all 4 cylinders. The
timing must still be off by a little, as i now have slightly less
power than i did before (at least it feels that way). I will
experiment with the timing once it (hopefully) passes inspection here
in PA. Thanks to all.

-Craig
'85GL Sunroof


On 11/20/06, Marion Lyle Lathem <skylink@mfire.com> wrote:
> Craig,
>     The inside of my rotor cap in the center melted... carbon gone, Bakelite
> melted some..? Your at that point that you are desperate... and would pull
> your hair out if you weren't so bumfuzzled.  I'm guessing it's something
> really simple, and you will kick yourself  when you find it..lol..!
>
>     Back off a few hours, or just wait until later, and think about all you
> have done to it...you have the answers already in your head... now just
> relax and think about it..!
> Good Luck, Lyle
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "craig cowan" <phishman068@gmail.com>
> To: "Marion Lyle Lathem" <skylink@mfire.com>
> Sent: Sunday, November 19, 2006 8:52 PM
> Subject: Re: firing on 3 cylinders.
>
>
> > yes i have the bentley, and anyone who disputes its not worth its
> > weight in gold or some less precious but still highly regarded and
> > valuable substance like copper.....is insane. Even armed with the
> > mighty Bentley, having exchanged the plugs, and having traded wires,
> > im still having the same problem. i truely believe i have the wires
> > mixed up on the cap. I'm lining them up in such a way that Plug one is
> > directy above where the rotor lines up at TDC, and to the left in a
> > clockwise rotation of that would be 4, then 3, then 2. Ive tried
> > switching things around, figuring "maybe im still just off somehow"
> > but regardless of where i put whatever plug, it either runs on those 3
> > cylinders, or runs worse/doesnt start. Its crazy. Tommorow i'll be
> > hunting through it all and replacing the Cap and Rotor (even though i
> > have the newest looking rotor ive ever seen in a scrap yard on there
> > now). Thanks for the help thus far. I'll be sure to keep you posted.
> >
> > -Craig
> >
> > On 11/19/06, Marion Lyle Lathem <skylink@mfire.com> wrote:
> >> Those wires can pull out of either end... check the # 4 spark plug wire,
> >> or
> >> trade wires and see if the problem changes with the wire.   I just
> >> stupidly
> >> has 3 and 4 cylinder's reversed on the cap.  Course before that, I had a
> >> world of trouble.  Try changing # 4 plug,  it has to be one of those two
> >> things, the wire or the plug if it idles down to 900 without shaking to
> >> pieces.
> >> Do you have a Bentley manual for your Vanagon..?
> >> Lyle
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "craig cowan" <phishman068@gmail.com>
> >> To: "Marion Lyle Lathem" <skylink@mfire.com>
> >> Sent: Sunday, November 19, 2006 6:52 PM
> >> Subject: Re: firing on 3 cylinders.
> >>
> >>
> >> > Yes its set to idle at 900, running beautifully. It used to have to
> >> > idle much higher to be hapy, now its happy right at 900. Smooth, for 3
> >> > cylinders. If i pull the wire from #4. It doesnt effect the way the
> >> > engine runs at all. This tells me that that cylinder is not firing.
> >> > I've changed the plugs with the plug from cylinder 2, and no change at
> >> > all. Even with #4's plug in 2, it runs. I even switched the wires
> >> > between the two. The wires were all replaced last year. #4 has
> >> > compression.... you can hear it with the plug out, and it can blow
> >> > your finger out of the cylinder. So....what did you end up doing? I
> >> > have not put a new cap on yet, but the cap looks pretty decent. I put
> >> > a new rotor on there. Its simply puzzling me. Any ideas would be
> >> > great.
> >> >
> >> > -Craig
> >> >
> >> > On 11/19/06, Marion Lyle Lathem <skylink@mfire.com> wrote:
> >> >> Craig,
> >> >>    You so describe what I had going on...it took me weeks to solve
> >> >> it...
> >> >> simply because I thought I knew what I was doing and doing it
> >> >> right...!
> >> >> Will it idle at 900 RPM's...and fairly smoothly..?  If you have to
> >> >> idle
> >> >> it
> >> >> up around 1300 to 1400 rPM's to get it smooth.. .then change the
> >> >> distributor
> >> >> cap wires 3 and 4... see what that does..?
> >> >> Good Luck, Lyle
> >> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> >> From: "craig cowan" <phishman068@GMAIL.COM>
> >> >> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
> >> >> Sent: Sunday, November 19, 2006 2:15 PM
> >> >> Subject: firing on 3 cylinders.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> > Hello again. I had my engine timed with the help of a local guy whos
> >> >> > good with timing, and it was running great. Then suddenly it started
> >> >> > to sound "strange". We tracked the problem to an exaust leak, and
> >> >> > the
> >> >> > sound is normal for an exaust leak. However, we wanted to rule out
> >> >> > that one of the cylinders wasnt firing, so while selectively
> >> >> > removing
> >> >> > the plug wires from the cap, we noticed that removing the wire from
> >> >> > cylinder 4, there is no change in the way the engine runs. If any
> >> >> > other wire is removed, the engine imediately runs poorly. This would
> >> >> > make it seem that cylinder 4 is not running. We've switched wires
> >> >> > between working cylinders, spark plugs, and a new rotor. With the
> >> >> > plug
> >> >> > removed turning the engine over, theres compression in that
> >> >> > cylinder.
> >> >> > We dont have a compression guage yet, but we know its enough to pop
> >> >> > your finger out of the hole. Yet, it seems to not be running. Last
> >> >> > thought is that the Cap is bad for that cylinder? I will try to get
> >> >> > a
> >> >> > new cap and see if that fixes things. Any sugestions on what to
> >> >> > check
> >> >> > would be great.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > PS: I believe it ran on all 4 before it was re-timed.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > -Craig Cowan
> >> >> > '85GL Sunroof
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >>
> >>
>
>