Date:         Fri, 22 Dec 2006 17:25:53 -0800
Reply-To:     Nathaniel Poole <npoole@TELUS.NET>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Nathaniel Poole <npoole@TELUS.NET>
Subject:      Re: "Granny Cars" (Element, Scion, etc)
In-Reply-To:  <BF57CB79-1895-44A0-94B1-D70D832D6BB4@comcast.net>
Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

But what all of the "cult" VWs had and have going for them are that they are
also weird. I mean, aircooled motors? And nothing else looks like them. The
bug was a design from the 30s, after all. And because of engineering
"quirkiness", they seemed to have personalities - you never know what one is
going to do.

Is being an ugly well-engineered vehicle enough to make a cult following? I
dunno. Do these things have personalities? It's my guess that that's one of
the reasons people name these old VWs.

I once owned a '74 Fiat Spider. Total POS, and it was a daily battle to see
who would come out on top, it or me, but I loved it. The roar of the
exhaust, the wood dash, the rattles, smell of the old vinyl, the handling.
Many years later I took a Miata for a drive. Good, modern, precise car,
quieter, better ride. Boring as hell. No heart, just a machine.

Maybe one of the reasons we like these old VWs because all their quirks and
imperfections and flaws show the human element behind them. Japanese
vehicles tend to look and feel like they were designed by computers. Old VWs
feel like they were design by bright, fat old guys named Helmut and Wolfgang
over too many tankards of beer. Helmut was busy scratching his balls and
Wolfgang was distracted by the thought of the upcoming visit by his gorgeous
sister-in-law when they came up with the first heater box.

Maybe it's the Helmuts and Wolfgangs we're really fond of, the crazy,
loveable buggers.

Nathaniel




On 12/22/06 2:53 PM, "Tom Buese" <tombuese@COMCAST.NET> wrote:

> On Dec 22, 2006, at 3:19 PM, Nathaniel Poole wrote:
>
>> I think the designers missed out on that one. IMO they are right up
>> there
>> with the pacer for just dumb ugly.
>
> That's what alot of people thought of the 1st VW's!!!!  People's
> perceptions gradually change over time as they are exposed to
> different views as to how something looks or is proper or cool or
> not. Just like Art!
>
>   20 years ago, no proper adult would have been caught dead driving a
> large SUV in the hood-now every other housewife, business person
> drives one & think they look great.!!!  The beauty & cache of a
> vehicle is usually not instantaneously achieved.  It  develops, or
> not,  depending on things like how well they work for most folks,
> perceived value, "coolness", etc.
> The vw bus  & bug were ridiculed by many, & now are cult vehicles,
> still ridiculed by many, but loved by those that perceive their
> functionality, economy, uniqueness,  & beauty?, etc.
>
> Tom B.-where's the old Borgward?
>
>
>
>> The purpose was spot on-young, outdoorsy,
>> adventure Jeep crowd. But you have to offer something besides
>> utility. Older
>> smarter folks don't care as much about what it looks like as what
>> it does,
>> but young folks want something they can show off. A jeep is an
>> icon. So is a
>> pimped-out Integra. But what does an element say besides nerd? If
>> they made
>> it with a interchangeable softop and hardtop, put a mean ugly grill
>> on front
>> with a half-dozen lights, aggressive wheels, something other than a
>> box with
>> a bunch of plastic panels (again, I'm approaching this from a
>> twenty-something perspective, no offense to anyone who owns one)
>> they could
>> reach a larger market.
>>
>> BTW, all the neighborhood kids love my vanagon; they've never seen
>> one and I
>> could sell it here in a heartbeat. If I put alloys on it and
>> lowered it, I
>> would have to chain it to the house or it would be gone the next
>> morning.
>>
>> Nathaniel
>>
>>
>> On 12/22/06 12:01 PM, "Mark Tuovinen" <mst@AK.NET> wrote:
>>
>>> Unfortunately for me young single women had not discovered Jeep
>>> onwership when
>>> I was driving them in the early `80's.  Now that I am older,
>>> married, and no
>>> longer have a Jeep I see many driven by women.  At least the cute
>>> young lady
>>> at the coffee stand down the street thinks my Vanagon is neat.:>)
>>>
>>> It is true that the Honda Element missed its target market of
>>> young California
>>> Surfer Boy's, while I know many young people that like them it is
>>> the `40 and
>>> up group that are purchasing them.
>>>
>>> Mark in AK
>>> Assistant Parts Manager
>>> Continental Honda and Acura
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: Nathaniel Poole <npoole@TELUS.NET>
>>> Date: Friday, December 22, 2006 10:28 am
>>> Subject: Re: "Granny Cars" (Element, Scion, etc)
>>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>>>
>>>> The jeep was always intended for a young demographic; all style
>>>> and little
>>>> utility. Its a four wheel drive two-seater convertible. Singles or
>>>> couples.And women LOVE trucks. A small rig like the jeep is just
>>>> the ticket.
>>>>
>>>> Nathaniel
>>>>>
>>>>>   Another vehicle that surprises me by having an odd 'driver
>>>> demographic' is
>>>>> the Jeep.  Whenever I see one of the 'old style' traditional
>>>> smaller jeeps...a
>>>>> cj or something...it is almost invariably driven by a young
>>>> woman on city
>>>>> streets..Wassup there?
>>>>>   Don Hanson
>>>>