Date:         Fri, 13 Jul 2007 09:41:54 -0400
Reply-To:     Jim Akiba <syncrolist@BOSTIG.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Jim Akiba <syncrolist@BOSTIG.COM>
Subject:      Re: Inside a Subi engine EJ22
In-Reply-To:  <071220071948.12029.46968595000BC35C00002EFD2200762302979A09019B0E0D9A9D@comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

No I would think just the opposite. Rearward weighting helps the
vehicle transition from straight line to corner entry without
understeering as much, that's why they do it in race cars, but in a
limited traction situation you can't take corners fast anyhow, so the
advantage of the rear weight bias is cornering is eliminated. If you
were to autocross one, or if you're an experienced driver you might be
able to notice it, but most people would never even notice the
difference.

The benefits to changing are not a generalization, it wouldn't be
worth it for most subie powered vanagon owners at all, especially if
they themselves already invested to convert. But in both cases, the
subies were running very poorly, and had experience multiple failures
over their lifetimes and thus broken the trust of their owners.
Additionally since neither owner was the original converter(which is
hugely important) there is no sense of needing to stick to it that is
felt by folks that have problems with vans they have had converted or
converted themselves. Remember these ej22s are old, they're old in
age, miles, and design. That isn't to say they aren't still good, but
depending on what you're after they're certainly not as good as what
else is available. The chief criteria for selection of them has always
been, they are more reliable and powerful than the boxer, and they
"fit like a glove". Well if the first thing ceases to be true, then
you only have fitting like a glove... and just as I said to Jake,
glove fitment is only part of the evaluation. If the glove isn't
suited to your purposes, or fails at something it should be able to
do, it won't matter if it fits well, it'll have to come off again
anyhow.

Jim Akiba

On 7/12/07, rubatoguy@comcast.net <rubatoguy@comcast.net> wrote:
> I wonder if the extra weight of the Subie motor yields better handling in inclement conditions.
> It is often lamented that the near 50/50 weight distribution makes the (non-syncro) vans mediocre handlers in the snow. I wonder if anyone with a Subie conversion can comment on foul weather handling vs. the stock wbx motor.
>
> And just out of curiosity, what are the perceived benefits from changing a Subie motor to a Ztec.
> Are the Subie motors that short lived?
>
>
>
> Todd
> '88 Westy
>
>
>
>  -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: Jim Akiba <syncrolist@BOSTIG.COM>
> > In short, yes.
> >
> > Here are the weights we measured with our first re-conversion:
> >
> > 86 Pass syncro, nothing else changed but the conversion, and both
> > equipped with AC.
> >
> > was 4280lbs w/ ej22
> > now 4220lbs w/ zetec
> >
> > Since the zetec is about 30-40 lbs heavier than the wbx setup, this
> > makes the ej22 90-100 heavier than stock.
> >
> > Our second subie to zetec re-conversion is happening next week, it is
> > an auto, and we'll also have before and after scale weights to
> > compare.
> >
> > Jim Akiba
> >
> > On 7/12/07, David Kao <dtkao0205@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > Ok, a probably stupid question to big guys. Is subi engine heavier
> > > than VW stock? It looks it has more metal than VW stock has. I am
> > > more interested in an ej25. It has even more metal than ej22.
> > > Ej25 are available for slightly over $1k here.
> > >
> > > Now if it is heavier and it is in the back will my westy look funny
> > > because the front end will want to go up than go forward when the
> > > rear end pushes?
> > >
> > > David
> > >
> > >
> > > --- benoit <huotb@VIDEOTRON.CA> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Men, the fun part as not began... splitting the core, but saldy, this
> > > > one will not be the one, it's to solid! i won't loose time in a
> > > > perfectly good running engine. It's funny how the part guy was lost at
> > > > the Subatu dealer when i ask about crank and rod bearing!!! he said, we
> > > > never sell those, they never go wrong!!!  ha ha ha....
> > > >
> > > > But if you have rebuilt/ work on 3.3, everything should look similar!
> > > > the EG33 is basicaly a bigger 2.2!!!!
> > > >
> > > > 2.2 are for kids... he he he, the SVX is for big Sycro guys!!!!
> > > >
> > > > Cheers, Ben
> > > >
> > > > dylan friedman wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Ben,
> > > > > Not only do you do good work, you document it so well.
> > > > > Thanks for the effort.
> > > > > I have rebuilt numerous EG33 engines, but never have seen a 22 close
> > > > > up as you show.
> > > > > Nice job!
> > > > >
> > > > > dylan
> > > > >
> > > > > Benny boy <huotb@VIDEOTRON.CA> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > >     Like i said earlier, here a some interesting picture (side by side
> > > > >     with a VW
> > > > >     engine), well, for those who like engine... for the other one, go
> > > > >     camping,
> > > > >     he he he.
> > > > >
> > > > >     http://www.benplace.com/subaru_ej22.htm
> > > > >
> > > > >     Cheers, Ben
> > > > >     http://www.benplace.com/vw2.htm
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > ________________________________________________________________________________
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>
>