Date:         Mon, 24 Sep 2007 20:25:41 -0700
Reply-To:     Joel Cort <joel_cort@YAHOO.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Joel Cort <joel_cort@YAHOO.COM>
Subject:      Re: Causes of rear brake soft pedal
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Shawn,

What I have found when there are mushy brakes (and no fluid leaking) after a good bleeding it that the brake master cylinder needs to be replaced.

It is available from the list vendors for about $100 or so and well worth it.  If your van sit a lot between camping trips, it may not be on the road enough to work the brakes and other parts.  The stationary master cylinder and the rubber o-rings will eventually decay and leak internally between the front and rear piston and cause some mush.

Easy job to do, keep the brake fluid off everything especially the rugs and seats.

Good luck,

Joel
87 Syncro Transporter (Stella B)
89 Syncro Westy (Panama Red)


----- Original Message ----
From: Raymond Paquette <raymondpaquette@GMAIL.COM>
To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2007 11:37:40 AM
Subject: Re: Causes of rear brake soft pedal


I can't see how air would get in by what you did.  Although I have replaced
pads (not shoes) and found that the caliper failed soon after-I assume that
the new pads put the pistons into a different and damaged part of the
cylinder.

One way you could test to see if the shoes are somehow retracting would be
to:

jack up a wheel or both
press and release the brake pedal
spin the wheel to get a sense for how much drag or shhh sound you get
try again later

Used to adjust air brakes using the shhh method.

Ray

On 9/18/07, Shawn Wright <vwdiesels@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Thanks for all the suggestions so far... I forgot to mention that did a
> full
> brake flush and bleed (as I do every 2 years) at all 4 when I replaced
> calipers in the spring. I didn't open the rear hydraulics this time, so
> didn't
> bleed anything as a result. I will do a quick bleed and see if it helps
> though.
> I'm pondering replacing the cylinders anyway, even though they're not
> leaking. Also, I did adjust manually before putting the drums back on,
> making as tight as possible without dragging. Pedal feel is good after the
> first pump - it's just the first pump if the pedal hasn't been used in a
> while.
> The parking brake is properly adjusted and works great.
>
> I'll bleed tonight and see if anything changes.
>
> On 17 Sep 2007 at 22:25, Shawn Wright <vwdiesels@GMAIL.COM> wrote:
>
> > Tonight I replaced the rear shoes on my '88 Westy, which were last done
> by
> > the dealer about 100k km (60k miles), but more than 10 years ago. I have
> > receipts from the PO showing all new drums, cylinders, shoes, etc were
> > used. The rear wheel cylinders show a fair bit of corrosion, but no
> weeping
> > under the seals, and they do seem to have the springs to prevent
> creeping, as
> > they extended slowly on their own when shoes were removed. With
> everything all
> > back together, I still have the soft pedal syndrome, where one or more
> pumps is
> > required to get a firm pedal. I was hoping this was the rear wheel
> cylinders
> > lacking those elusive springs. Front pads and calipers are new in the
> spring. So
> > the problem must lie in the booster or the master cylinder, right? Tips
> on
> > narrowing this down appreciated.
> >
> > Thanks.
> > Shawn Wright
> > http://members.shaw.ca/vwdiesels
> > '88 Westy 1.6TD 5 speed
> > '85 Jetta Diesel 1.6NA
>
>
> Shawn Wright
> http://members.shaw.ca/vwdiesels
> '88 Westy 1.6TD 5 speed
> '85 Jetta Diesel 1.6NA
>


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