Date: Sun, 23 Sep 2007 14:48:57 -0400
Reply-To: pdooley <psdooley@VERIZON.NET>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: pdooley <psdooley@VERIZON.NET>
Subject: Re: ECU firmware location
In-Reply-To: <1b0df96d0709221633p177ada74h6e31a0e51736e1a8@mail.gmail.com>
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
MS is a time pit.
But the knowledge gained is worth it IMO.
You don't have to move it from car to car. You can build one for less than
the cost of a VW AFM.
Optimizing sensors, tuning, etc. is much less complicated with a wide band
O2 sensor.
MS also provides data logging so you see where you are rich/lean.
You can tune your idle and cruise to burn lean and save fuel at the same
time fatten it up at certain RPM and load for max power.
It doesn't require a whole factory team of engineers.
As far as squeezing performance- yes you can do that with MS. You can make
minor changes like a different cam or ratio rockers or do a complete engine
swap to a turbo Subaru or golf motor and still keep the same ECU.
The only requirement is adjust the ignition and fuel maps via laptop and
send to the firmware in the ECU.
Couple that with fact you have your choice of cheap readily available
factory sensors to integrate with the system.
I know MS is not the best choice for everyone on this list, but for me the
choice is clear.
-----Original Message-----
From: tinker man [mailto:tinkerman007@gmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2007 7:33 PM
To: pdooley
Cc: Vanagon mailing list
Subject: Re: ECU firmware location
The MS might be good and flexible, but it sure seems like a time pit...
And I don't think I'd like to move it from car to car - I think one
time will be more than enough for me...
I'm pretty happy with the stock system, as long as it works, because I
can always take it to the garage if I can't fix it or too busy. A
custom system rules this out.
Installing a new system IMO is actually attempting to develop an
engine control system on your own and tuning it, even if the basic h/w
(electronics boards) is working. Adapting to current sensors, problem
solving and optimizing usually requires a whole team at the factory,
and I don't have that kind of experience.
Nope, not for me...I'd rather spend my time camping...:-)
MS is probably for those enjoying playing a lot with the engine and
squeezing more performance out of it.
But I salute all those who try!
Cheers,
TM
On 9/17/07, pdooley <psdooley@verizon.net> wrote:
> MS is a major time investment.
> On the plus side, there is lots of valuable information to learn.
> Even advanced folk like you can still learn a few things. :)
>
> The great thing about MS is you are not limited to old archaic components.
> Like GM parts? You can use a GM PWM idle speed controller.
> Like Ford? You can integrate their slick EDIS spark control into the MS
> ECU.
>
> Yes, it is time intensive, but you can build a fully laptop programmable
ECU
> for a couple hundred bucks. Alter fuel and spark curves on the fly.
> Even if you decide to do an engine swap to Subaru or a 350 Chevy you get
to
> keep the ECU, just re-program it from your laptop.
> Never pay for another chip burn and rid yourself of VW AFM's, ECU's and
> ISCU's.
>
> Having said that, I still think what you are doing is necessary and a
great
> service to the Vanagon community.
> Keep up to good work!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: tinker man [mailto:tinkerman007@gmail.com]
> Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 10:21 PM
> To: pdooley
> Subject: Re: ECU firmware location
>
> Hello dude, let me decide how much time I want to spend just to drive
> my van to camping...:-)
> This Megasquirt project sounds ambitious, albeit a bottomless pit of
> time investment. Right now I'll stick to what I've got, good enough
> for me...
>
> On 9/17/07, pdooley <psdooley@verizon.net> wrote:
> > Well Mr. Tinkerman, if you live up to your name and like to tinker then
> > spend a few hours and read the Mega-manual.
> > http://megasquirt.info/
> > This is the future.
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: tinker man [mailto:tinkerman007@gmail.com]
> > Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 7:56 PM
> > To: pdooley
> > Cc: vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com
> > Subject: Re: ECU firmware location
> >
> > Hehehe...I'm sweatin' here and you call it a good reading...:-)
> > Actually, there was a guy on this list attempting to do just that:
> >
http://gerry.vanagon.com/cgi-bin/wa.exe?A2=ind0709a&L=vanagon&D=0&P=11816
> >
> > I'm indeed reverse engineering it to simply fix my damned van...(and
> > to help other listees too). These devices are hard to find here. Take
> > a look here to some of my findings:
> > http://www.vanagonwiki.net/index.php/Second_type_of_idle_control_system
> >
> > On 9/17/07, pdooley <psdooley@verizon.net> wrote:
> > > Ahhh, but you are trying to reverse engineer it.
> > > That would lead me to believe you plan on building an upgraded or
> perhaps
> > > more durable unit.
> > >
> > > Either way, please continue. It makes for good reading:)
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On
Behalf
> Of
> > > tinker man
> > > Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 5:27 PM
> > > To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> > > Subject: Re: ECU firmware location
> > >
> > > You got me wrong...
> > > I wasn't planning to re-invent the wheel (i.e. design and build my own
> > > ISCU), just fix those darn (original) ECU and ISCU...
> > >
> > > On 9/15/07, pdooley <psdooley@verizon.net> wrote:
> > > > Sudhir, I was thinking the same thing.
> > > > The amount of brainwork going into this project is more than just
> > changing
> > > > to MS.
> > > > However, if these talented individuals can design and build their
own
> > ISCU
> > > > to interface with the stock ECU, well that would be good for the
> entire
> > > > Vanagon community.
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On
> Behalf
> > Of
> > > > Sudhir Desai
> > > > Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2007 9:32 AM
> > > > To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> > > > Subject: Re: ECU firmware location
> > > >
> > > > You could always install a Megasquirt, and not have to worry about
any
> > > > of this. :D
> > > >
> > > > Sudhir
> > > >
> > > > On 9/15/07, tinker man <tinkerman007@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > Hi all,
> > > > >
> > > > > This is kinda getting in-depth into embedded systems design, but
> does
> > > > > anybody know if the firmware for our ECU's (Digifant or Digijet)
> > > > > resides completely on the 2732 EPROM or is part of it contained
also
> > > > > INSIDE the microcontroller itself?
> > > > > The reason I'm asking this is because I suspect I have a fried
> > > > > microcontroller (Intel 8049H) but if it's a custom version with
> > > > > protected firmware inside, replacing it won't solve the problem.
My
> > > > > CPU reads:
> > > > > MAF 8049H P A167
> > > > > 078801
> > > > > DSD8905V5 U
> > > > > WBX82HSCH
> > > > > (C) INTEL 1977
> > > > >
> > > > > That WBX82HSCH stuff seems to hint it's a custom version
> > > > > (WBX=WaterBoxer) with protected firmware, with some of the
firmware
> > > > > also outside in the external EPROM.
> > > > > Any guru's out there?
> > > > >
> > > > > Cheers,
> > > > > TM
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
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