Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 14:08:10 -0500
Reply-To: Nathan Mc Blain <nmcblain@YAHOO.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Nathan Mc Blain <nmcblain@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: Re: Clutch shutter, vibation, shaking - why?
On Wed, 7 Nov 2007 23:45:00 -0800, Scott Daniel - Shazam
<scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM> wrote:
>Severe clutch chatter is usually oil on the disc.
>Sometimes you can even burn it off by starting out, from a stop, in 2nd or
>3rd just slipping the hell out of the clutch....like it might take a whole
>block to get the clutch all the way out, you have to slip it that much,
>starting out in 2nd or 3rd .
> That's burn the oil off the disc, by golly......it 'might' temporarily
>reduce the chatter affect. Do it several times if needed.
I'll try to burn it off, just afraid it was more severe damage and didn't
want things coming apart?
>No such thing as a warped vanagon flywheel in my world. They seldom are a
>problem.
Glad to hear that- thikin it's expensive
>Extremely unlikely air in hydraulics is the cause.
Thank you for conferming it!
>Clutch disc springs do get loose. Haven't seen it too much, but they can
>fall out of place, or jam, I've never seen a broken one.
So to you this could be the problem but you havn't seen one break? Even
after being engaged VERY hard? I want to figure out what that penny in a
can sound is from.
>Sounds like your cluch hydraulics are tired.
Yes they are- I just hate putting alot of new expensive parts when the van
body has the amount of rust it has.
>Brake fluid for those has probably never been changed from the sound of
>things.
I did change bleed everything back in late 2004 but already past it's 2
year mark-oops.
>Wouldn't be surprised if the clutch was very, very worn out inside the bell
>housing.
>For oil leak - ream main seal, possibly clutch input shaft seal.
>Check the transmission oil level.
>Sounds like it might need 'a lot' possibly, a lot of repair operations and
>parts, that is.
The oil leak sounds like a great possiblity. Sounds like probably I have
to remove the trans.
Thank you much.
Nate 90 2.1L MT silver non/GL
>Scott
>www.turbovans.com
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf Of
>Nathan Mc Blain
>Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 11:02 PM
>To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>Subject: Clutch shutter, vibation, shaking - why?
>
>List,
> The good news is all the coolant repairs and parts are holding thanks to
>the info gained from everyone Thanks.
>
> The bad news is my van is having clutch problems - alot of shaking when
>letting out the clutch. Noticed mostly in reverse but really bad now in
>first,second. Once I get going things are OK but I'm afraid of total
>failure so have stopped using it. For a long time I have had a klinkity
>klink like a penny in a can noise and also a screeching noise at certain
>RPMS. The catalytic converter did come apart and I replaced it and emptied
>the muffler. I hate to ask questions and try to just listen and learn but
>now I have to ask.
>
> Some history: When I first inherited this van 2004 it started having
>clutch problems-suddenly there was just very slight grab nothing to move
the
>vehicle. At the time this list and any knowledge of vanagons was unknown
to
>me. It got stuck in my uncles yard. To make a long story short he tried
to
>help me without my knowledge and while heavily intoxicated. He just
floored
>it until it grabbed layed a good strip of grass and rubber when it reached
>the asphalt-not nice to my van:( At the time I thought oil was on the
>flywheel and sprayed brake cleaner in the access hole with the motor
>running...probably washed grease out of places it should be and other bad
>stuff - stupid me!!!
>
> This Sunday I described this and everything I know to a young
professional
>mechanic acquaintance (execpt for the brake cleaner blunder) of mine- he's
a
>very good mech but not at all familiar with the uniqueness of our vans or
>the expense of the parts. He's too busy to take another job but has
offered
>to let me pull the trans with his tools at his house. Anyway he thought my
>flywheel is warped. And together we came up with the thought that one of
>the dampening springs in the clutch disk may have broken. I'm wondering if
>one of the springs on the clutch disk broke and is bouncing around in the
>belhousing? That would account for the penny in a can noise. Is this
>possible, plausible, common?
>
> While I was under there today preparing trans removal if needed -spraying
>all the corroded bolts trans/engine bolts with liquid wrench. I tried
>pushing up on the clutch lever to see if the slave would move and it did
>with medium resistance. Is that normal? Can air in the clutch system do
>this? And cause my shuttering and shaking? My mechanic acquaintance says
>no what do you say? I read somehere in the archives that it could but it
is
>difficult to always determine fact from fiction as EVERTHING is in the
>arcives.
>
> FWIW:Under the boot the slave is wet- some weeping. I also have a weep
>coming from the dash end of things but cannot see if it is brake master or
>clutch master. So air could and probably is entering.
>
> Sorryfor the longwinded e-mail. In short:
> What's the most likely cause to severe clutch shutter?
> Do the disk springs ever break, could that be the cause?
> Is it easy to warp the flywheel?
> Can air in the clutch system be a cause?
>
> TIA,
> Nate 90 2.1L MT silver non/GL- who just wants to avoid unessisary trans
>removal and fix the shaking
>
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Scott
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