Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 12:00:43 -0500
Reply-To: Jim Akiba <syncrolist@BOSTIG.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Jim Akiba <syncrolist@BOSTIG.COM>
Subject: Re: Calif 2008 emissions fuel tank pressure testing?
In-Reply-To: <6da579340803022241t10e46c20gae67734bef88f4e6@mail.gmail.com>
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This is one of the regulations that is being introduced to help force
fleet overturn in CA. It has very little if anything to do with
controlling emissions directly, but it must appear so. The idea is to
make it expensive and difficult to maintain an older vehicle in CA.
Japan and Germany both do this already, and it is going to proceed
with more intensity in CA unless something changes.
CA needs to force old vehicles off the road for multiple reasons, and
it does make sense in the context of their goals and resources. The
CARB had figures of 17% of CA registered vehicles being over 150K
miles in 1995. The number then jumps to an astounding 41% over 150K
miles in 2000... more than double in less than 5 years. It is easy to
see the panic that this trend would cause them, since older vehicle do
pollute more than newer vehicles even if one was simply comparing two
identical vehicles one new, one over 150K.
As a secondary problem, or potential benefit is that as CA forces
overturn, some of those will purchase new vehicles.. which is
essential in order to appease the OEMs which will otherwise launch
further efforts and lobby to stifle CARB anti-pollution regulation. If
CA is going to demand really strict pollution limits and durability
requirements, they must also sell cars for the OEMs to offset the
burden of compliance.
In the end it does makes sense to do this, but it is the particular
way they are going about it that might be a problem, and unfortunately
guys like us that love our older vehicles will be caught in the tide
regardless of our individual efforts or intent. This is exactly the
condition that prevents us from selling conversion into CA.. why would
they extend any extra effort to exempt a small set of vehicles if they
don't have to? Which is why they don't anymore. Much has changed in
their understanding of the urgency of their situation, which is why
the OBDI engine conversion can still get a CARB EO since the exemption
potential was established a while ago.. and it's also why on last
check there is not a single legal OBDII CARB EO'd(exempted) engine
conversion of any kind for any vehicle in CA.
Keep an eye out, as the trend should continue over the next few years.
Luckily this isn't a real show stopper for CA vanagon owners.. but
that isn't to say there won't come a time when it'll make more sense
to either leave CA or sell your van. I think they will continue to
ramp this kind of legislation up to the limits of the current
political situation. If it turns out that too many people protest
their attempts and make it dangerous for politicians to support, they
will be scaled back in pace, but they are very unlikely to stop what
has already started.
Jim Akiba
On 3/3/08, John Bange <jbange@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > So, California Vanagon owners: anyone here on the list had any experience
> > getting smogged in 2008? They pump your fuel tank up and did you pass or
> > fail miserably (as I expect my '84 will)?
> >
>
>
> I had mine smogged last month, and yes indeed, that was officially part of
> the test. Thing is, the whole scheme is ludicrous and generally a waste of
> time, according to the guy who ran the test only station I was at. It's
> simply pointless feel-good regulation burdening the test shop owners with
> another mandatory equipment purchase and returning little in the way of
> results. The trouble is that whoever made up the new regs was a suit-wearing
> bureaucratic drone and not an automotive engineer. The intent was to extend
> the integrated evap system test for OBD-II vehicles to non-OBD vehicles. The
> "test" is easy on an OBD-II system as the ECU monitors the evap system
> automatically and stores an error code if there's a problem. The test
> station need only check for error codes and do a quick seal check on the gas
> cap. Gas caps are largely standardized now, so fitting it to the pressure
> tester is no trouble.
>
> Enter the asinine evap test for pre-OBD2 vehicles. This consists of an
> expensive system to pressurize (or maybe evacuate?) the fuel tank vent
> system through the fuel filler hole, keep it at pressure(vacuum?) for 15
> minutes or so, and rate it based on how much leakage there is. The problem?
> Prior to OBD2, manufacturers made gas caps and filler pipe openings just any
> old way they felt like. The expensive pressure system has a half dozen
> adapters to fit some of the more common makes of cars, but according to the
> guy at the test place, more than half of the pre-OBD cars he sees cannot be
> hooked up to the system for lack of a suitable adapter, and the sheer
> variety makes it unlikely that any such adapters will be made. The "rubber
> stopper with locking lugs" cap on my 90 Vanagon is one of those.
> Subsequently, the test guy just put "NA" in the box that asked for the test
> results and sent me on my way, as per CARB instructions. Maybe the 84
> filler/cap system is different and WILL fit the machine, but I very much
> doubt it. Worst case scenario, you could replace your old filler neck with a
> late model one, and never have to take the test. I'd be surprised if they
> had an adapter that fit though.
>
>
> --
> John Bange
> '90 Vanagon - "Geldsauger"
>
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