Date: Thu, 8 May 2008 22:29:11 -0400
Reply-To: Allan Streib <streib@CS.INDIANA.EDU>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Allan Streib <streib@CS.INDIANA.EDU>
Subject: Re: DIY alignment? (Also, alignment numbers)
In-Reply-To: <4823AF91.3000707@charter.net> (John Rodgers's message of "Thu\,
8 May 2008 20\:57\:37 -0500")
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
John Rodgers <inua@CHARTER.NET> writes:
> I don't know about adjusting the camber, but at one time on the 'net
> someone had posted pics on how to do the toe-in and get it right
> enough. As I recall, you needed some straight pins, a stick of
> chalk marker, and a couple of squeeze bottle of yellow mustard.
>
FWIW, I think that the DIY techniques should only be used to get
"close enough" to drive to the alignment shop, in the event that
you've done something to get the alignment really out of whack (maybe
replaced the tie rod ends and forgot to measure where they were set,
etc.)
An alignment is not so expensive that it is not worth getting it done
properly. Your tires will last longer and your car will handle better
and be safer. That said, here's one link:
http://www.allpar.com/fix/alignment.html
Also, this was posted by Scott "Shazam" a while back when I was asking
about it:
To: Syncro@yahoogroups.com
From: "Scott Daniel - Shazam " <ScottDaniel@turbovans.com>
Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2007 19:42:04 -0800
Subject: RE: [Syncro] Uneven tire wear - normal specs ?
If anyone is interested, I'll tell you the 'back yard string and yard
stick' method To see if the alignment on any car is about right, and
if it's the same left to right. ( it's actually two yards sticks and
a carpenter's level, and a short foot long measurer )
1. you need a flat level hard paved surface, for one thing.
2. Next, check the tire pressures, put them where you want them for
normal use, measured cold.
3. you might want to put a sack of concrete on the driver's seat to
simulate the driver's weight which will always be there when the van
is going - in normal practice no one does this.....but it would have a
small affect.
4. you want it stopped gently with the suspension settled. Drive
gently to a stop and stop the van with the parking brake.
5. measure toe-in. get the two yard sticks, and try to measure between
the two forward 90 degrees up from the ground spots on the front
tires, and the corresponding rear identical spots.
Sometimes you can't get the yard sticks right at the 3 o'clock and 9
o'clock positions... .but get as close to that as you can ...and
measure what the toe-in is. A lot of cars like 1/16 of 1/8 of an inch
of toe-in. That is, the front tires are turned in toward each other
just a tiny bit.
Measure it several times. If you get that it's a half inch toed-in, or
a like amount toed-out, that's probably not right. Most cars are just
slightly toed in. whatever it is just leave it for now.
6. next get an idea of camber. That's whether the tops of the tires
lean in toward each other ( negative camber ) or their tops lean
outward - positive camber.
If you get one side, say, the left, is leaning in, and the right is
leaning out -......that' s not right, and would cause a pull or drift
to the right. Some cars run a tiny bit of negative camber, some a
little positive ...... but see if you get a reasonable measurement
there.
You do this with a 2 foot carpenter level ( remember, the surface you
do this on has to be level. Use the level to see if the floor is
pretty level. If it is, stand the level up next to a tire......hold
it exactly vertical as indicated by the bubble, using the small ruler,
measure to the edge of the rim at the top of the wheel, and at the
bottom. If they are equal....it' s Zero Camber. If the top leans
outward...that' s positive camber . ( it's adjusted by an eccentric
bolt on the upper a-arm inner pivots, btw. )
7. Next is Castor. This is like how a bicycle fork isn't vertical, but
angled forward so that when you turn the handlebars, the wheel tilts
when it turns. This is the castor affect. Turn the steering full
right. You should find that the right tire leans outward quite a bit
- even two inches. ( use the level to measure it ) You'll probably
find that the left tire leans in just a bit, like maybe a half
inch. This would be what I'd expect, roughly, on most cars. If you get
something totally weird....... like the camber doesn't go positive on
the right tire when you turn full right ....something is off. Or both
tires are positive camber turned full right or full left - I wouldn't
expect to see that.
Now turn it full left and measure how the wheels lean when full
left. You should get the opposite of what you go when turned to the
right. If you don't....... by a large difference.. ..something is not
right. I don't know if they do it anymore, but a long time ago it was
common to make the camber or castor slightly different from
side-to-side to compensate for the fact that many two lane roads are
crowned....higher in the middle, and it was to prevent the car from
drifting right on that slope......I don't know if this is still done
much, I doubt it. But this could account for a slight variation left
to right.
Oh yes....you gotta have a decent front end in the first place to do
this. Ball joints, especially lowers, that have play, can be hard to
identify with the suspension hanging down.....kinda takes the slop out
of them. And there are ways to check that of course. Need to make sure
there's not tie rod play, or bushings shot to hell, or upper ball
joints shot etc. Anyway...it' s not hard to check if your front
alignment is in the ball park this way. Very low tech, but even
medium accurate if done carefully.
Oh yeah, if you do go changing toe-in ...the easiest one to deal
with.....that' s usually fairly harmless if you calculate that it's
pretty off. Changing camber.....you don't normally want to do that
.....cause if you change the camber, it also affects toe and castor
and you can get messed up there if you're not careful.
My intention here is to give people an easy, low tech way, to do a
basic check on their front alignment, to see if it's even slightly
where it belongs.
If Syncro's have characteristics that are very different than what
I've described for 'most cars' ...I'm all ears.
