Vanagon EuroVan
Previous messageNext messagePrevious in topicNext in topicPrevious by same authorNext by same authorPrevious page (July 2008, week 1)Back to main VANAGON pageJoin or leave VANAGON (or change settings)ReplyPost a new messageSearchProportional fontNon-proportional font
Date:         Tue, 1 Jul 2008 23:30:22 -0400
Reply-To:     pickle vanagon <greenvanagon@GMAIL.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         pickle vanagon <greenvanagon@GMAIL.COM>
Subject:      Re: Hybrid Vanagon
Comments: To: Jim Akiba <syncrolist@bostig.com>
In-Reply-To:  <ac1f198b0806300806s30d9d4f2qfc90cbe9349ea064@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

I think the point that's being missed here, is that a big chunk of the gas savings in hybrid comes from the fact that the ability to occasionally boost from the electric motor allows a smaller gas engine. This is where the real savings come in, and why hybrids do get better mileage on highways even though their electric motors aren't getting used much then---their engines are smaller, so you're not burning fuel in more cylinders than you need.

In other words, you're not really going to much gas by installing a hybrid system in a vanagon unless you swap out the engine for a smaller one (!!) as well. Around town you'll get the benefits of regenerative braking, but I'd be surprised if that alone bought you more than 2-3mpg or so in around-town driving.

-Wes

On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 11:06 AM, Jim Akiba <syncrolist@bostig.com> wrote:

> But why actually do you disagree with my statements? Because you have > a hybrid civic? I'm not really certain I follow your line of argument. > Lot's of vehicles achieve much higher mpg than a vanagon, this doesn't > mean their powerplants would do the same *in* a vanagon. Ever towed > anything with a prius for instance? You're not supposed to for good > reason, it's so close it's output limits in stock form that even > pulling a light motorcycle overworks it into sending the mpg into the > low 20's. Try towing with the civic, it might be a telling exercise > as to what the increase in frontal area and drag of the vanagon might > do to overall economy, and why it's not worth it for hwy driving. > > Jim Akiba > > On Sun, Jun 29, 2008 at 3:43 PM, Ikard <fikard@comcast.net> wrote: > > I disagree completely with the assessment you gave about the benefits of > a > > hybrid for long haul driving. I own a Honda Civic Hybrid and get 45 mpg > on > > the freeway at 72 mph. I get about 36 in the city. > > I have an 80 Vanagon with a 95 Jetta gas engine in it but it is so new > that > > I have not road tested for mileage. Would love to have a hybrid system in > > it. > > > > Charlie Ikard > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com]On Behalf > > Of Jim Akiba > > Sent: Sunday, June 29, 2008 7:17 AM > > To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM > > Subject: Re: Hybrid Vanagon > > > > > > Keep in mind that a hybrid will be a total waste of time/money for > > the vast majority of vanagon owners. Vanagons are typically long-haul > > vehicles, not city drivers, the hybrid's benefits will be almost > > completely lost on long haul driving. not to mention that $15k-$25k > > buys a lot of gas. You *might* be able get 100mpg by installing a > > 200cc engine and driving at 35, but it's a lot easier/cheaper to get a > > motorcycle. Getting the hybrid into a vanagon it totally doable, in > > fact with a synco front end, you could do an easy(relatively speaking) > > front/rear electric/gas hybrid.. but it isn't, and likely will never > > be worth it. > > > > Jim Akiba > > > > > > > > On Sat, Jun 28, 2008 at 11:27 PM, M'obeechi <obeechi@runbox.com> wrote: > >> I don't want to give up on gasoline completely - I'm spending too much > on > > the subaru engine (now the second type, a turbo) to walk away... but I > think > > the writing is on the wall for a hybrid approach. Not sure if Fuel Cell > > still stands a change (MBZ hasn't given up on them), and then there are > > electric and gasoline hybrids... I just want to extend my mileage in the > 100 > > miles per gallon range... but yeah, waiting it out makes sense... > However, I > > do want to be among the first 100 vanagon owners who take the plunge into > > doing this. Might be tricky figuring out how to squeeze this into the > > Vanagon. > >> > >> From: Robert Fisher <refisher@MCHSI.COM> > >> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM > >> Subject: Re: Hybrid Vanagon > >> > >>> My initial thought on this is that if you want to get away from > internal > >>> combustion entirely or even mostly, than you might want to wait 3-5 > > years. > >>> There are a number of technologies or approaches that are 'on the > cusp', > > so > >>> to speak, that should have either failed or made a breakthrough by then > > and > >>> the practical options should be clearer. > >>> > >>> Cya, > >>> Robert > >>> > >>> ----- Original Message ----- > >>> From: "M'obeechi" <obeechi@RUNBOX.COM> > >>> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM> > >>> Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2008 5:50 PM > >>> Subject: Hybrid Vanagon > >>> > >>> > >>> I was looking up hybrid vehicles. Something in Wikipedia was saying > > better > >>> to start with a car that has a manual transmission, that the AT wastes > >>> energy. But they were talking about a conversion that removes the > > internal > >>> combustion engine. I'm interested in maybe one day putting in electric > >>> motors or what-ever-is-good to supplement the engine in my vanagon > (which > > is > >>> Subaru at this point). Thing is, I have an Automatic and want don't > want > > to > >>> consider a manual. > >>> > >>> Can someone point me in the right direction. Has this been discussed or > > done > >>> with a vanagon yet. I'm not really thinking propane, I'm in Southern > >>> California, plus my engine is being switched over to a turbo, and since > >>> propane needs high compression, I don't think that would make sense. > >>> > >>> The paper today said that jet fuel cost has increased 80% this year. I > > won't > >>> be surprised if gasoline reaches 25 dollars a gallon within the decade. > >>> > >> > >> ----- End Original Message ----- > >> > > >


Back to: Top of message | Previous page | Main VANAGON page

Please note - During the past 17 years of operation, several gigabytes of Vanagon mail messages have been archived. Searching the entire collection will take up to five minutes to complete. Please be patient!


Return to the archives @ gerry.vanagon.com


The vanagon mailing list archives are copyright (c) 1994-2011, and may not be reproduced without the express written permission of the list administrators. Posting messages to this mailing list grants a license to the mailing list administrators to reproduce the message in a compilation, either printed or electronic. All compilations will be not-for-profit, with any excess proceeds going to the Vanagon mailing list.

Any profits from list compilations go exclusively towards the management and operation of the Vanagon mailing list and vanagon mailing list web site.