Date:         Thu, 4 Dec 2008 20:49:32 -0600
Reply-To:     Jim Felder <jim.felder@GMAIL.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Jim Felder <jim.felder@GMAIL.COM>
Subject:      Re: Heaters for winter camping
Comments: To: Tom Buese <tombuese@comcast.net>
In-Reply-To:  <69DCA624-FD7C-48C8-8C17-E5BACCF2DAFA@comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Great idea, mounting it like that. It doesn't quickly warm the volume
of the westy, but if you use it right--use it to knock the chill off,
run it on low during the night so things are not so cold in the
morning, but don't depend on it for instant warmup--it does pretty
well. Here in the south we do not often experience camping weather
below 30, especially during daylight hours. Nights often bring temps
as low as 17 and even lower, but those are not all that common.
There's no substitute for blankets or a down bag for a good night's
sleep on a cold night. It's just that if you don't run the heater your
water might be frozen too.

On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 1:17 PM, Tom Buese <tombuese@comcast.net> wrote:
> I have the same Wave 3 heater that hangs from 2 small screws mounted into
> the top of the front westy table leg & can rotate to face several
> directions.  It is attached to a quick connect propane hose w/ shutoff valve
> to the propane line under the sink, & can be removed & installed in seconds.
>  I generally store it under the rear seat when not in use.  Works great like
> Jim said, but only in mild weather.  Does not heat well like a Propex, etc.
> when the temp. is under 30 degrees in my experience.  3000 BTUH is not
> enough to quickly warm the volume of the westy? That said, I have never
> tried it when the poptop is down or that space is insulated from the lower
> space.  I will try that this Winter.
>
> YMMV,
>
> Mr. BZ
>
>
> On Dec 4, 2008, at 11:49 AM, Jim Felder wrote:
>
>> I don't want to start a heater flame war (pun obviously intended) but
>> I did want to mention that I use the olympic Wave III heater mounted
>> on the bulkhead aft of the passenger seat, facing backwards, and I am
>> very happy with it. It is plumbed through the floor to a tee into the
>> propane supply and has an independent shutoff from the rest of the
>> system to the stove and fridge.
>>
>> It is very efficient and doesn't use as much oxygen that the Mr. Buddy
>> and Plat Cat heaters do, which is why I bought it. It's more
>> expensive, though. It's the size of a pack of 250 sheets of paper
>> almost exactly.
>>
>> It doesn't produce much condensation, and I have installed a 4 inch
>> computer fan over the stove window to make sure that proper air
>> exchange takes place. You can see the fan mounting details at
>> <http://www.knology.net/~felder/Vanagons/> I use one or both of the
>> fans to exhaust cooking fumes, too.
>>
>> Other than the tiny bit of electricity needed by one of the fans, the
>> heater of course draws nothing from the battery. The system is utterly
>> simple and dependable.
>>
>> Jim
>>
>> On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 11:52 AM, Chris S <szpejankowski@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> John,  google tent propane heaters.  They should be cheap to make with
>>> air coming in through the sliding window via a custom block-off panel.
>>>
>>> On 12/4/08, John Rodgers <inua@charter.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Heating a van in winter when camped out and away from external electric
>>>> power is always problematic, it seems to me. Catalytic heaters produce
>>>> moisture and the risk of carbon monoxide poisoning. Any kind of open
>>>> flame gas heater has the same problem. The gasoline fired heaters under
>>>> the rear seat are very pricey. So trying to get some sort of heat is a
>>>> bit of a problem.
>>>>
>>>> So, how about this concept. An external, propane fired burner, with
>>>> circulating hot water(antifreeze coolant)  to supply the heat to a
>>>> radiating core (rabbit heater core)  inside the van.  A small blower fan
>>>> would circulate the air across the heater core. A small inline
>>>> circulating pump could be installed in the coolant line if needed -
>>>> something wih very low power drain. If the core was made to mount in a
>>>> window like is done with some airconditioners, then the heater element
>>>> could sit on the ground outside  and thermosiphon action would circulate
>>>> the coolant.- no circulating pump necessary - only a small blower fan.
>>>> It could be taken down quickly when breaking camp. Another possibility
>>>> would be a permanent mount of the heater core with the coolant lines
>>>> being fixed in place, but run to the a point outside the vehicle to
>>>> allow quick disconnect fittings for hookup/removal  of the propane
>>>> burner element. when ready to hit the road.
>>>>
>>>> Just some heater thoughts on a miserable rainy morning in the deep
>>>> south. And to think - when my water line to the broke night before last,
>>>> temps were such that the water spraying on a large grassy plant made a
>>>> beautiful ice image standing in the morning sun. And this morning it is
>>>> raining. Southern winter weather. Yuk!
>>>>
>>>> John Rodgers
>>>> Chelsea, AL
>>>>
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>>>
>>> --
>>> Sent from my mobile device
>>>
>>> Chris S.
>>> Disclaimer: "Death and serious injury may occur"
>>>
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