Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 13:35:30 -0800
Reply-To: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Subject: Re: Making of a Vanagon - Now New T3
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re
"Bottom line, it would be nice to have a new,updated Vanagon, however a
1970s design does not lend itself to the demands of modern production, etc.
"
It wouldn't be a 70's design anyway, and all the current practices employed
to keep manufacturing costs in line could still be employed, quite easily.
I assume you wouldn't say that about Porsche if you didn't think it was
true - I've not heard that about Porsche. They do quite well financially
from what I read. And their cars are not cheap either !
.........particularly the 911's.
A modern transporter could be assembled in Mexico for the north American
market, just like New Beetles are, and some Jettas.
Even the wiring harness for a 90's Subaru legacy says 'hecho in Mexico' on
it.
more...........
just think of what excellent cars we could have if humans didn't make 500
different models of cars ........if they didn't overproduce more than will
sell easily.
Sure would love to see the major car manufactures promote modesty and
humility, rather than flash and hugeness as automotive and truck virtues.
Scott
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Golen" <rgolen@HOTMAIL.COM>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 6:40 PM
Subject: Re: Making of a Vanagon - Now New T3
It would be great to have a new Vanagon, however it boils down to simple
economics. Ten years ago I managed to get a VIP tour of the Type II assembly
plant in Hannover where they were producing the T4. My guide had mentioned
that the number of man-hours that went into producing the T4 were 40% of
those used for the T3,and that the T3 was still being produced (1998) in
South Africa because the labor costs there were low enough to make it
feasible.
VW, as well as most car manufacturers design and build their cars to utilize
the minimum of man-hours. For example the Golf II used 35 man-hours of
labor. The succeeding Golf III used 18 man-hours. Now, rather than building
whole cars (the original Beetle in the 1950s was 90% VW content), companies
now assemble groups of sub-assemblies. The total content of VW made parts in
the Golf V is down to 38%. The rest of the Golf is assembled from parts
(seats, dash/control assemblies, etc) from sub-contractors that are located
no more than 20 miles from the Wolfsburg plant. All parts arriving within 45
minutes of then they are needed.
Porsche, which was once famous for its hand assembly of cars, almost went
out of business in the mid nineties because they "built great cars at a
loss". They hired consultants from Toyota and Nissan in 1997 and within
three years cut the number of man-hours in the 911 by 60%.
Bottom line, it would be nice to have a new,updated Vanagon, however a 1970s
design does not lend itself to the demands of modern production, etc.
Ric
> Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 17:32:02 -0800
> From: regnsuzanne@YAHOO.COM
> Subject: Re: Making of a Vanagon - Now New T3
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>
> I've brought the idea to the list before, that is to create a website
> dedicated to convincing VW to re-open the T3 assembly line, albeit with
> updated electronics and power train.
>
> Folks voiced their skepticism with objections that Andrew has debunked
> below, i.e. that the vehicle COULD be brought up to current USA & Canadian
> safety standards.
>
> I would love to have a new T3 TDI Syncro.......I think that a lot of
> people would......
>
> Anthony
> '89 Syncro GL (Hidalgo)
>
>
> --- On Tue, 12/2/08, Andrew Grebneff <goose1047@GMAIL.COM> wrote:
> From: Andrew Grebneff <goose1047@GMAIL.COM>
> Subject: Re: video: Making of a Vanagon
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 6:23 PM
>
> >> You're not forgetting about air bags, and ABS brakes and such
> things ,
> >> right
>
> T3s were available with ABS. Airbags are easily added. Stability
> control likewise (but this is no guarantee of safety... "Wheels" in
> Australia recently tested a Toyota Kluger (=Highlander) and the
> stability control did NOT step in when it should have... and the
> vehicle rolled several times (and the Aussie market demands much
> better suspension than US).
>
> >> since the only 'people sit right in front' vehicles sold in
> north America
> >> are trucks. ( I'm thinking those Isuzu cab-over diesel delivery
> trucks and
> >> similar cab-over trucks )
> >> In all cars , mini-vans, and people haulers, the occupants are
> mid-mounted
> >> these days.
>
> Well, the Japanese have continued with forward-control vans (and
> likewise the 2nd-generation Mitsubishi Delica made by Hyundai as the
> H100). These must be passing Euro NCAP offset-head-on crashtests,
> which the T3 would pass with flying colors.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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