Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 13:36:57 -0800
Reply-To: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Subject: Re: Starter solenoid current
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there was a discussion about solenoids and current draw on tdi-conversion
about 10 months ago.
Seems no one ever had to look deeply into it, but when they did, on Bosch
starters....
at least some of them...........there is a 'pull winding' and a 'hold
winding' .....
the initial pull current would be the higher one I imagine.
and what size fuse is blowing ? .....and I assume this is in the 'trigger
circuit' .......the signal that energizes the solenoid.
Stock, that current goes through the small electrical contacts of the
ignition switch........
and it's never been fused, and it's never been an issue.
For a normal 'starter booster relay' .........the current branch that
operates the solenoid would not be fused.
As Dennis says........there are numerous unfused circuits.
the starter trigger signal is one.
Ignition to the coil is another.
I have never ever had any need or occasion to measure current draw in the
solenoid trigger circuit, in thousands of cars or vanagons.
If it was excessive........the starter itself comes to mind. I treat the
starter.......made up of 3 main parts........the motor, the solenoid, and
the bendix drive gear, as a whole unit. I don't believe in 'bad solenoids'
.......though of course that can happen.
I would be tempted to unfuse the trigger current path.......
and if need be, try another starter if the one now fitted is a decent Bosch
rebuilt one that's not too, too old.
( and the goofy things people do modifying VW wiring circuits........don't
even get me started !! )
If it's a cheapy, the starter, .......or it looks 20+ years old.........you
know.
Also.,.......good ground connection, transmission to body, and body to
starting battery .........can't say enough how those have to be right, and
solid, and clean.
Personally........I have never liked a starter booster relay down there by
the mud and yuck and grease.
What I have done for a personal keeper Vanagon is install an entire new,
heavy duty, starter trigger circuit.
I get a heavy duty generic starter button from a FLAPS ........a GOOD
starter button, not something from china that cost 2 bucks.......
but a solid good high quality starter button, and mount it in the dash right
above the light switch......nice spot there.
Then I wire that with large wires, straight from the battery, to the switch,
to the starter trigger terminal on the starter solenoid.
You won't have troubles with a well-installed circuit like this. I keep
the stock 'through-the-key' circuit as well. I might run that through a
booster relay......but I've just not found booster relays to be long term
'solid and reliable.'
Have fun, do good work !
Scott
www.turbovans.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dennis Haynes" <d23haynes57@HOTMAIL.COM>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2009 8:38 PM
Subject: Re: Starter solenoid current
> There are a number of circuits on the Vanagon that are not fused. Starter,
> starter solenoid, fuel pump and injectors and some other stuff, ignition
> coil, etc. The solenoid usually pulls ~9 amps measured but you will see a
> spike that will confuse most amp meters.
>
> Dennis
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf Of
> Larry Alofs
> Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2009 11:22 AM
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Subject: Re: Starter solenoid current
>
> Where is this fuse? In the circuit from the ignition switch that triggers
> the relay or in the circuit from the relay to the solenoid?
> About 6 months ago I took a starter from an '84 AT and connected +12 from
> a battery to the push-on terminal that activates the solenoid. As I
> recall,
> I measured about 37 amps.
>
> Larry A.
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 13, 2009 at 9:03 AM, William Greenamyer
> <greenamyer@yahoo.com>wrote:
>
>> I have had one of those starter relays for a long time now. Usually has
> no
>> problems but it seems that the 15 amp fuse occasionally blows and I have
>> not
>> been able to find the problem. No apparent shorts in the wiring
>> (everything
>> routed away from metal) so I am guessing it is the solenoid itself. It
>> works but the last time the fuse went, it just barely blew. Before
>> blowing,
>> it apparently reduced the current which didn't help starting. What
>> should
>> I
>> be looking at for a solenoid current for a Vanagon starter (manual
>> trans)?
>>
>> William
>>
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