Date:         Thu, 5 Mar 2009 22:44:39 -0800
Reply-To:     David Kao <dtkao0205@YAHOO.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         David Kao <dtkao0205@YAHOO.COM>
Subject:      Re: Lack of brakes long version saga actually
In-Reply-To:  <61bf971e0903052201u7e7a5aa2g5f282dffc7e1fe9c@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

The self-adjust mechanism will take a long time to complete
the self adjustment to an optimal point. Last year I did a rear
drum brake job on my 84 GL. I did manually adjusted the shoes
but the brake pedal still took too much travel, about half way,
before braking would begin. I bled the system many times and
no change. So I gave up more bleeding. I had to pump the pedal
twice each time for the pedal to be high enough.

Well, about 6 months or so later I discovered that the problem
suddenly went away. The pedal became firm and I did not need
to pump it twice. I realized that the self-adjust mechanism
finally got it to the optimal point. It has been like that for
6 more months. The brake works really well as of now.

David


--- On Thu, 3/5/09, A J I <flavanagon@GMAIL.COM> wrote:

> From: A J I <flavanagon@GMAIL.COM>
> Subject: Re: Lack of brakes long version saga actually
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Date: Thursday, March 5, 2009, 10:01 PM
> I did run the shoes out until they were dragging a little on
> the drums.
> Pulled the drums off and backed them down just a bit
> figuring the self
> adjusters would bring them to where they need to be. There
> is still a very
> slight rub when "spinning" the wheel so the shoes
> have to be close.
> I am using the Bentley and unfortunately it only gives
> specs not procedure
> so I am relying on my old mechanic ability but must admit
> to no VW or
> Vanagon mechanical experience but I do have a decent
> mechanics background. I
> used to own a body shop and did more than my share of
> mechanical work and
> driveline swaps, even some custom work. I believe I have
> working knowledge
> of basic mechanics but havent done any such for the last 15
> years or so
> other than "tinkering".
>
> My bleeding preceedure is to start with the right rear and
> have help,
> translates to wife, pump the pedal three times slowly. I
> work around to the
> left rear then the right front and finally the drivers
> front. I even tried a
> passive bleed where I open the bleeder them the pedal is
> pushed. I close the
> bleeder and the pedal is released. No difference in either
> the pump or
> passive method as to results
>
> Under normal circumstances I would consider this action as
> a failure of the
> master or "bleed by" in the master but as I said
> VW is a whole different
> creature and I am staedy finding things that just dont work
> the same as on
> the older domestic vehicles that I did work on. I enjoy the
> Vanagon and it
> is/was my daily driver. As of late it is more driveway
> stationary art than
> driver.
> I will tear down the rears again tomorrow and double check
> but if I can hear
> the shoes moving and gripping then releasing I am assuming
> that there isnt
> going to be anything "jumping out" at me that I
> missed. I may try adjusting
> the shoes up a tighter to a noticable drag and see if that
> helps.
>
> Is there an adjustment hole in the backing plate to adjust
> the rears? I
> adjusted them to the point of being able to get the drums
> on not with the
> drums on because I didnt see any means of adjusting them
> after assembly.
> Maybe that is the problem?? Can anyone offer the proper
> proceedure for
> adjusting the rears? Maybe a page somewhere with detailed
> instructions or
> pics/ It would be a help.
> Thanks again ,
>
> A J
>
> 87 GL 4 spd
> 91 GL auto
>
>
> On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 12:37 AM, Mike Collum
> <collum@myfairpoint.net> wrote:
>
> > You didn't say exactly what your bleeding
> procedure is.
> >
> > Also, you didn't say that you adjusted the new
> shoes (I'm assuming you
> > installed new shoes as fluid contaminated the old
> ones).  Shoes, not
> > adjusted, or adjusted too far out, will cause the
> pedal to go to the floor
> > on the first depression and will then "Pump
> up".
> >
> > I always use a motive power bleeder and don't stop
> the bleeding when I
> > first get nothing but fluid.  I often find that, as I
> continue to bleed,
> > there are bubbles further up the line that eventually
> show up.
> >
> > Mike
> >