Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 14:24:23 -0700
Reply-To: Jake de Villiers <crescentbeachguitar@GMAIL.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Jake de Villiers <crescentbeachguitar@GMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: Takes a darn long time for the heater to come up to speed
In-Reply-To: <49B82094.90603@gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Umm, call me old-fashioned, but you can get very good results using your
HAND to see if the relevant hose is flowing warm water.
Its pretty easy to see which hoses from the thermostat housing go to the
heater loops and which goes up front to the rad.
Apply fingers as necessary. :-)
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 1:35 PM, Rocket J Squirrel <
camping.elliott@gmail.com> wrote:
> What's the easy way to tell whether the thermostat stays properly shut
> until the engine reaches temperature? I was thinking of starting the
> engine, take the temp of the radiator with an infrared thermometer,
> watching the temp gauge, and, according to my theory, when the gauge
> starts to indicate operating temperature the radiator should suddenly
> start warming up. That should work, right?
>
> --
> Mike "Rocket J Squirrel" Elliott
> 84 Westfalia: Mellow Yellow ("The Electrical Banana")
> 74 Utility Trailer. Ladybug Trailer, Inc., San Juan Capistrano
> Bend, OR
> KG6RCR
>
>
>
>
> On 3/7/2009 4:37 PM Scott Daniel - Turbovans wrote:
>
>> yes you should.
>> I highly recommend the correct 'real' right German thermostat.
>> ......the hotter of the two temps available normally.
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> *From:* Rocket J Squirrel <mailto:camping.elliott@gmail.com>
>> *To:* Scott Daniel - Turbovans <mailto:scottdaniel@turbovans.com>
>> *Sent:* Saturday, March 07, 2009 4:24 PM
>> *Subject:* Re: Takes a darn long time for the heater to come up to
>> speed
>>
>> Thanks, Scott. I replaced the thermostat a couple years ago while
>> doing an R&R on the water pump. That was the hard way. The
>> replacement thermostat was a "cooler" one which the vendor
>> (busdepot? I forget) helpfully sent instead of the correct temp
>> one. Once I found out that the engine wasn't being allowed to come
>> up to the design temperature I didn't feel like taking things
>> apart again. I really should get that done, though, put in a
>> proper temp range one.
>>
>> --
>> Mike "Rocket J Squirrel" Elliott
>> 84 Westfalia: Mellow Yellow ("The Electrical Banana")
>> 74 Utility Trailer. Ladybug Trailer, Inc., San Juan Capistrano
>> Bend, OR
>> KG6RCR
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 3/7/2009 4:12 PM Scott Daniel - Turbovans wrote:
>>
>>> There are two ways to do the t-stat on a 1.9 waterboxer.
>>> one is to take the whole housing off............which is good since
>>> you want
>>> to know that those long studs, which easily get very, very
>>> corroded,........
>>> to be sure they are not badly rusted, so that's an advantage to doing
>>> it
>>> this 'proper' way.
>>>
>>> the other way is to directly unbolt the t-stat cover from underneatht
>>> he
>>> van.
>>> On some engines the t-stat cover will clear the exhaust pipe, and it's
>>> easy
>>> to replace the t-stat.
>>> On some engines it won't quite clear the exhaust pipe. On one t-stat
>>> cover I
>>> had to grind away a tiny bit of metal on the t-stat cover to get it to
>>> clear.
>>> It wastes fuel and is much rougher on the engine if it doesn't run up
>>> to
>>> temp properly., so quite important to have right.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Rocket J Squirrel" <camping.elliott@GMAIL.COM>
>>> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
>>> Sent: Saturday, March 07, 2009 7:16 AM
>>> Subject: Re: Takes a darn long time for the heater to come up to speed
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I reckon there are two things that I need to observe: 1. the time it
>>>> takes for the temp gauge to start moving from the cold pin (Mrs
>>>> Elliott's Subaru comes up a lot sooner), and 2. how soon before one
>>>> starts to feel tendrils of warmed air come creeping out of the vents.
>>>> Again, it's much quicker in the other car. If these are significantly
>>>> longer time than others, like Jake, observed then something there's
>>>> something fishy going on. Given that the thermostat is such a pain to
>>>> get to on the 1.9l engine, I'll want to be fairly sure that replacing
>>>> it
>>>> is a worthwhile project.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Mike "Rocket J Squirrel" Elliott
>>>> 84 Westfalia: Mellow Yellow ("The Electrical Banana")
>>>> 74 Utility Trailer. Ladybug Trailer, Inc., San Juan Capistrano
>>>> Bend, OR
>>>> KG6RCR
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 3/6/2009 9:47 PM Jake de Villiers wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On account of this thread I paid attention this morning on the way
>>>>> to
>>>>> work
>>>>> in the grey van. It took about a mile at ~30 degrees F. to feel a
>>>>> difference, about 3 for it to be warmish.
>>>>>
>>>>> I've noticed that the rear heater gets warm a lot quicker on both
>>>>> vans.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 5:35 PM, alfred bagdan <abagdan@shaw.ca>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> If you have the rear heater valve open, most of the hot coolant
>>>>>> goes
>>>>>> through
>>>>>> the rear heater. Try closing the rear heater and see what happens.
>>>>>> Also
>>>>>> replace your thermostat in case it is stuck open. If the
>>>>>> temperature
>>>>>> gauge
>>>>>> does not go up to the halfway point in cold weather, you will
>>>>>> probably
>>>>>> have
>>>>>> to replace the thermostat to get some decent heat. Its a bitch of
>>>>>> a
>>>>>> job,
>>>>>> but doable. When I replaced the hoses last summer I also put pipe
>>>>>> insulation on the hot lines and also replaced the thermostat and
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> water
>>>>>> pump. What a difference that made. I live in Edmonton, Canada,
>>>>>> and I
>>>>>> drove the van once this winter when it was -30C ( ~ -20F ) and it
>>>>>> was
>>>>>> warm
>>>>>> as toast inside, and didn't take long to warm up.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Alfred
>>>>>> 85 Westy
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>> From: "Mark Tuovinen" <mst@AK.NET>
>>>>>> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 06, 2009 2:49 PM
>>>>>> Subject: Re: Takes a darn long time for the heater to come up to
>>>>>> speed
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You just send her up here to drive my Syncro on a cold(subzero)
>>>>>> morning,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> she will appreciate your van much more afterward. My kids ride to
>>>>>>> school
>>>>>>> with a blanket over them for warmth and they are wearing winter
>>>>>>> coats,
>>>>>>> hats, mittens, and boots at the same time. Vanagons have a rather
>>>>>>> large
>>>>>>> area to warm up and the front core is a long way from the heat
>>>>>>> source.
>>>>>>> Though it won't cure your problem you could put pipe insulation on
>>>>>>> your
>>>>>>> front heater hoses under the van. This will reduce the heat loss
>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>> occurs before the hot coolant gets to the core. Another and more
>>>>>>> difficult issue to deal with is that the front heater only draws
>>>>>>> air
>>>>>>> from
>>>>>>> outside, it does not recirculate cabin air. Thus while your
>>>>>>> heater
>>>>>>> core
>>>>>>> is trying to warm the air, the air is trying to cool the core.
>>>>>>> Not an
>>>>>>> issue in moderate climates but those in extreme cold areas suffer
>>>>>>> because
>>>>>>> of it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Mark in AK
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>> From: Rocket J Squirrel <camping.elliott@GMAIL.COM>
>>>>>>> Date: Thursday, March 5, 2009 4:35 pm
>>>>>>> Subject: Takes a darn long time for the heater to come up to speed
>>>>>>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> My wife's Subaru Outback's heater is ready to put out some
>>>>>>> serious
>>>>>>> therms
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> in about 3 minutes of drive time. The temp gauge comes up
>>>>>>>> quickly,
>>>>>>>> whereas the temp gauge in ol' Mellow Yellow needs another 5-8
>>>>>>>> minutes
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> driving in freezing temps to really start to creep upwards and
>>>>>>>> for the
>>>>>>>> heater to start doing anything interesting.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'd like to think that the difference is due to the awesome
>>>>>>>> efficiency
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> the WBX engine . . . I'd like to think that, but something tells
>>>>>>>> me
>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>> a 2006 Subaru engine is a tad more efficient. So, does anyone
>>>>>>>> have any
>>>>>>>> idea why the 1.9L engine is so sluggish compared with the
>>>>>>>> Outback's
>>>>>>>> engine when it comes to making hot water available to the heater
>>>>>>>> core?
>>>>>>>> Mrs Squirrel gripes about how long it takes to get warm air to
>>>>>>>> come
>>>>>>>> out
>>>>>>>> the heater and I'd like to have some highly-technical answer to
>>>>>>>> respond
>>>>>>>> with. You know, baffle them with BS?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Mike "Rocket J Squirrel" Elliott
>>>>>>>> 84 Westfalia: Mellow Yellow ("The Electrical Banana")
>>>>>>>> 74 Utility Trailer. Ladybug Trailer, Inc., San Juan Capistrano
>>>>>>>> Bend, OR
>>>>>>>> KG6RCR
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>> Jake
>>>>>
>>>>> 1984 Vanagon GL
>>>>> 1986 Westy Weekender "Dixie"
>>>>>
>>>>> Crescent Beach, BC
>>>>>
>>>>> www.crescentbeachguitar.com
>>>>> http://subyjake.googlepages.com/mydixiedarlin%27
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
--
Jake
1984 Vanagon GL
1986 Westy Weekender "Dixie"
Crescent Beach, BC
www.crescentbeachguitar.com
http://subyjake.googlepages.com/mydixiedarlin%27
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