Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 22:50:37 -0500
Reply-To: Jeff Palmer <jpalmer@MTS.NET>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Jeff Palmer <jpalmer@MTS.NET>
Subject: Re: Takes a darn long time for the heater to come up to speed
In-Reply-To: <BA637AEB587B4B30BB18E8D8490AC1CE@MAINCOMPUTER>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes
I don't think you can get a block heater for a Vanagon. I think you
need an oil pan heater, non? That's what I've always used.
Jeff in Winnipeg
On 11-Mar-09, at 10:34 PM, Courtney Hook wrote:
> Good God man! You're in Bend, and don't know about block heaters??
> What is
> this world coming to?? :-)
> They come in different flavors, but essentially are a inline heater
> that
> goes into the cooling either via a heater hose or similar way, and get
> plugged into an outlet. It keeps your coolant warm/hot, and when you
> fire up
> the beast in the morning, the coolant is already hot, and ready to
> warm
> you're toasty feet. They also keep the engine alive in those lovely
> -45
> mornings up here in B.C. I remember always checking under my hood
> before
> firing up the truck because a fine collection of cats, rats, coons,
> squirrels etc would think a nice warm engine block was pretty good
> when the
> mercury went sub zero. :-)
> Courtney
> (On balmy Vancouver Island)
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rocket J Squirrel" <camping.elliott@GMAIL.COM>
> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
> Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2009 8:26 PM
> Subject: Re: Takes a darn long time for the heater to come up to speed
>
>
>> So how does one use a block heater? What is this mystical device?
>> --
>> Mike "Rocket J Squirrel" Elliott
>> 84 Westfalia: Mellow Yellow ("The Electrical Banana")
>> 74 Utility Trailer. Ladybug Trailer, Inc., San Juan Capistrano
>> Bend, OR
>> KG6RCR
>>
>>
>>
>> On 3/11/2009 8:04 PM Don Hundt wrote:
>>
>>> Mike,
>>> You might think about finding a block heater for your van. I have a
>>> diesel
>>> dodge pickup that has about 4 gallons of coolant in it, lots of
>>> fluid to
>>> heat up. Blows warm in just a couple minutes after being plugged
>>> in for a
>>> few hours, even on the coldest Central Oregon mornings.
>>> Don
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Rocket J Squirrel" <camping.elliott@GMAIL.COM>
>>> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2009 7:29 PM
>>> Subject: Re: Takes a darn long time for the heater to come up to
>>> speed
>>>
>>>
>>>> On 3/11/2009 2:51 PM Scott Daniel - Turbovans wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Sometimes
>>>>> it won't even get up to full temp, in town, at low load and rpm
>>>>> ......even
>>>>> with a good new german t-stat IF ..........
>>>>> you have the heater on from the begging ( a bad thing in cold
>>>>> temps )
>>>>> and
>>>>> it's very cold.
>>>> Ah -- a lesson learned. Keep the heater slider off until there's at
>>>> least
>>>> some activity visible on the ol' temp gauge.
>>>>
>>>>> And shortish in town trips in very cold temps..............is
>>>>> really
>>>>> rough
>>>>> on a waterboxer.
>>>>> It would bee worth it to cruise out of town on the highway for 5
>>>>> miles,
>>>>> turn
>>>>> around, then go about your town errands, in very cold
>>>>> temps.........like
>>>>> 20
>>>>> degrees F and below.
>>>> Short trips are about all I'm taking with Mellow Yellow right
>>>> now. If
>>>> the
>>>> weather or sunlight situation are not suitable for cycling, I
>>>> takee the
>>>> Vanagon.
>>>>
>>>>> I just pulled this inline 110Volt AC 'house power' electric
>>>>> heater out
>>>>> of
>>>>> a
>>>>> parts van of mine. I gotta put that in my heater circuit of my
>>>>> van and
>>>>> plug
>>>>> it in overnight while it's still cold. Sure would be nice if the
>>>>> engine
>>>>> coolant was partially warmed up, and all the coolant in the heater
>>>>> circuit
>>>>> was already warm, soon as I start 'er up !
>>>> Sigh. One can dream, no?
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Mike "Rocket J Squirrel" Elliott
>>>> 84 Westfalia: Mellow Yellow ("The Electrical Banana")
>>>> 74 Utility Trailer. Ladybug Trailer, Inc., San Juan Capistrano
>>>> Bend, OR
>>>> KG6RCR
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 3/11/2009 2:51 PM Scott Daniel - Turbovans wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> the stock temp gauge sender is pretty close to the thermostat.
>>>>> so when that comes off the peg...........
>>>>> it's starting to close off the bypass circuit flow in the
>>>>> engine, and
>>>>> starting to send coolant toward the radiator.
>>>>> And the sender shows the temp of the radiator circuit
>>>>> coolant .........
>>>>> they'd want to read the hottest coolant as it comes out of the
>>>>> engine.
>>>>> < shoot, come to think of it........
>>>>> has anyone ever bothered to figure out if a water boxer
>>>>> thermostat is
>>>>> on
>>>>> the
>>>>> return side from the radiator , or on the 'feed to the radiator'
>>>>> side.
>>>>> Most
>>>>> newer engines have the t-stat on the return side to the
>>>>> engine........
>>>>> like all vw inline fours gas and diesel since the 1975 Rabbit,
>>>>> like
>>>>> Subaru
>>>>> engines etc. I never bother to check that out )
>>>>>
>>>>> The thermostat in a waterboxer engine is a 'two door' thermostat
>>>>> ........two cirucits ............one is 'bypass'. around and
>>>>> around
>>>>> through
>>>>> the engine.......
>>>>> bypassing the radiator circuit. The other circuit is the radiator
>>>>> circuit.
>>>>> The t-stat switches gradually over from one circuit to the
>>>>> other. The
>>>>> Heater
>>>>> circuit is something else of course, and not termostated in any
>>>>> way.
>>>>>
>>>>> That might even take 10 minutes...........as as it blends from the
>>>>> bypass
>>>>> circuit to the radiator circuit.
>>>>> so the change over is gradual. My guess is that at 25 % gauge
>>>>> defelction
>>>>> (
>>>>> halfway from zero reading to mid-defliction, by the LED ) is
>>>>> about half
>>>>> split between bybass circuit, and radiator circuit.
>>>>>
>>>>> You won't see 'full thermostated' temp at the radiator until
>>>>> after it's
>>>>> been
>>>>> in the radiator only portion for a short while. Like fully up to
>>>>> temp,
>>>>> plus
>>>>> a few more minutes, depending on rpm ( water pump speed ) . In
>>>>> town at
>>>>> lower speeds, lower load, it takes longer to get fully up to temp.
>>>>> Sometimes
>>>>> it won't even get up to full temp, in town, at low load and rpm
>>>>> ......even
>>>>> with a good new german t-stat IF ..........
>>>>> you have the heater on from the begging ( a bad thing in cold
>>>>> temps )
>>>>> and
>>>>> it's very cold.
>>>>>
>>>>> the best deal is a new german, OE quaility thermostat in the
>>>>> higher of
>>>>> two
>>>>> temps offered. Warmer is better, cooler is not.
>>>>> And shortish in town trips in very cold temps..............is
>>>>> really
>>>>> rough
>>>>> on a waterboxer.
>>>>> It would bee worth it to cruise out of town on the highway for 5
>>>>> miles,
>>>>> turn
>>>>> around, then go about your town errands, in very cold
>>>>> temps.........like
>>>>> 20
>>>>> degrees F and below.
>>>>> I just pulled this inline 110Volt AC 'house power' electric
>>>>> heater out
>>>>> of
>>>>> a
>>>>> parts van of mine. I gotta put that in my heater circuit of my
>>>>> van and
>>>>> plug
>>>>> it in overnight while it's still cold. Sure would be nice if the
>>>>> engine
>>>>> coolant was partially warmed up, and all the coolant in the heater
>>>>> circuit
>>>>> was already warm, soon as I start 'er up !
>>>>>
>>>>> scott
>>>>> www.turbovans.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "neil N" <musomuso@GMAIL.COM>
>>>>> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2009 1:57 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: Takes a darn long time for the heater to come up to
>>>>> speed
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 1:35 PM, Rocket J Squirrel
>>>>>> <camping.elliott@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> What's the easy way to tell whether the thermostat stays
>>>>>>> properly
>>>>>>> shut
>>>>>>> until the engine reaches temperature? I was thinking of
>>>>>>> starting the
>>>>>>> engine, take the temp of the radiator with an infrared
>>>>>>> thermometer,
>>>>>>> watching the temp gauge, and, according to my theory, when the
>>>>>>> gauge
>>>>>>> starts to indicate operating temperature the radiator should
>>>>>>> suddenly
>>>>>>> start warming up. That should work, right?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Short of removing the thermostat, boiling it in a pot of water
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> watching/measuring with a thermometer, I would suggest aiming
>>>>>> your IR
>>>>>> gun at the thermostat housing. See when the temp goes up there.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I would imaging that measuring at the rad would take longer.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Neil.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Neil Nicholson '81 VanaJetta 2.0 "Jaco"
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://tubaneil.googlepages.com/
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/vanagons-with-vw-inline-4-cylinder-gas-engines
>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus
>>>> signature database 3929 (20090311) __________
>>>>
>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>>>>
>>>> http://www.eset.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
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