Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 23:04:55 -0400
Reply-To: Don Hundt <dhundt@BENDBROADBAND.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Don Hundt <dhundt@BENDBROADBAND.COM>
Subject: Re: Takes a darn long time for the heater to come up to speed
Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=response
Mike,
You might think about finding a block heater for your van. I have a diesel
dodge pickup that has about 4 gallons of coolant in it, lots of fluid to
heat up. Blows warm in just a couple minutes after being plugged in for a
few hours, even on the coldest Central Oregon mornings.
Don
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rocket J Squirrel" <camping.elliott@GMAIL.COM>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2009 7:29 PM
Subject: Re: Takes a darn long time for the heater to come up to speed
> On 3/11/2009 2:51 PM Scott Daniel - Turbovans wrote:
>
>> Sometimes
>> it won't even get up to full temp, in town, at low load and rpm
>> ......even
>> with a good new german t-stat IF ..........
>> you have the heater on from the begging ( a bad thing in cold temps ) and
>> it's very cold.
>
> Ah -- a lesson learned. Keep the heater slider off until there's at least
> some activity visible on the ol' temp gauge.
>
>> And shortish in town trips in very cold temps..............is really
>> rough
>> on a waterboxer.
>> It would bee worth it to cruise out of town on the highway for 5 miles,
>> turn
>> around, then go about your town errands, in very cold temps.........like
>> 20
>> degrees F and below.
>
> Short trips are about all I'm taking with Mellow Yellow right now. If the
> weather or sunlight situation are not suitable for cycling, I takee the
> Vanagon.
>
>> I just pulled this inline 110Volt AC 'house power' electric heater out of
>> a
>> parts van of mine. I gotta put that in my heater circuit of my van and
>> plug
>> it in overnight while it's still cold. Sure would be nice if the engine
>> coolant was partially warmed up, and all the coolant in the heater
>> circuit
>> was already warm, soon as I start 'er up !
>
> Sigh. One can dream, no?
>
> --
> Mike "Rocket J Squirrel" Elliott
> 84 Westfalia: Mellow Yellow ("The Electrical Banana")
> 74 Utility Trailer. Ladybug Trailer, Inc., San Juan Capistrano
> Bend, OR
> KG6RCR
>
>
>
> On 3/11/2009 2:51 PM Scott Daniel - Turbovans wrote:
>
>> the stock temp gauge sender is pretty close to the thermostat.
>> so when that comes off the peg...........
>> it's starting to close off the bypass circuit flow in the engine, and
>> starting to send coolant toward the radiator.
>> And the sender shows the temp of the radiator circuit coolant .........
>> they'd want to read the hottest coolant as it comes out of the engine.
>> < shoot, come to think of it........
>> has anyone ever bothered to figure out if a water boxer thermostat is on
>> the
>> return side from the radiator , or on the 'feed to the radiator' side.
>> Most
>> newer engines have the t-stat on the return side to the engine........
>> like all vw inline fours gas and diesel since the 1975 Rabbit, like
>> Subaru
>> engines etc. I never bother to check that out )
>>
>> The thermostat in a waterboxer engine is a 'two door' thermostat
>> ........two cirucits ............one is 'bypass'. around and around
>> through
>> the engine.......
>> bypassing the radiator circuit. The other circuit is the radiator
>> circuit.
>> The t-stat switches gradually over from one circuit to the other. The
>> Heater
>> circuit is something else of course, and not termostated in any way.
>>
>> That might even take 10 minutes...........as as it blends from the bypass
>> circuit to the radiator circuit.
>> so the change over is gradual. My guess is that at 25 % gauge defelction
>> (
>> halfway from zero reading to mid-defliction, by the LED ) is about half
>> split between bybass circuit, and radiator circuit.
>>
>> You won't see 'full thermostated' temp at the radiator until after it's
>> been
>> in the radiator only portion for a short while. Like fully up to temp,
>> plus
>> a few more minutes, depending on rpm ( water pump speed ) . In town at
>> lower speeds, lower load, it takes longer to get fully up to temp.
>> Sometimes
>> it won't even get up to full temp, in town, at low load and rpm
>> ......even
>> with a good new german t-stat IF ..........
>> you have the heater on from the begging ( a bad thing in cold temps ) and
>> it's very cold.
>>
>> the best deal is a new german, OE quaility thermostat in the higher of
>> two
>> temps offered. Warmer is better, cooler is not.
>> And shortish in town trips in very cold temps..............is really
>> rough
>> on a waterboxer.
>> It would bee worth it to cruise out of town on the highway for 5 miles,
>> turn
>> around, then go about your town errands, in very cold temps.........like
>> 20
>> degrees F and below.
>> I just pulled this inline 110Volt AC 'house power' electric heater out of
>> a
>> parts van of mine. I gotta put that in my heater circuit of my van and
>> plug
>> it in overnight while it's still cold. Sure would be nice if the engine
>> coolant was partially warmed up, and all the coolant in the heater
>> circuit
>> was already warm, soon as I start 'er up !
>>
>> scott
>> www.turbovans.com
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "neil N" <musomuso@GMAIL.COM>
>> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
>> Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2009 1:57 PM
>> Subject: Re: Takes a darn long time for the heater to come up to speed
>>
>>
>>> On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 1:35 PM, Rocket J Squirrel
>>> <camping.elliott@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> What's the easy way to tell whether the thermostat stays properly shut
>>>> until the engine reaches temperature? I was thinking of starting the
>>>> engine, take the temp of the radiator with an infrared thermometer,
>>>> watching the temp gauge, and, according to my theory, when the gauge
>>>> starts to indicate operating temperature the radiator should suddenly
>>>> start warming up. That should work, right?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Short of removing the thermostat, boiling it in a pot of water and
>>> watching/measuring with a thermometer, I would suggest aiming your IR
>>> gun at the thermostat housing. See when the temp goes up there.
>>>
>>> I would imaging that measuring at the rad would take longer.
>>>
>>> Neil.
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Neil Nicholson '81 VanaJetta 2.0 "Jaco"
>>>
>>> http://tubaneil.googlepages.com/
>>>
>>> http://groups.google.com/group/vanagons-with-vw-inline-4-cylinder-gas-engines
>>
>
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