Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 15:32:31 -0700
Reply-To: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Subject: Re: 87 2.1 loss power
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it won't hurt especially to pull one plug wire at a time , as if looking for
a weak cylinder ......
which you shouldn't be having.
I'd invest time into the fuel system myself......
inspect spark plugs,
check in fuel filter - empty it out backwards to see what's in there, and
check for how clogged it is.
test fuel pressure, and fuel pressure regulator.
I would check injector spray pattern too if I didn't find anything prior to
that fuel system-wise that's obviously not right.
we'll assume the switch inputs are making it all the way to the ecu, but you
could check that.
Ground connections always come to mind.
Air flow meter pops into my mind, though I haven't replaced one of those for
running rich ever.
a cylinder not firing wouldn't make it run rich.
The injectors being held open longer than they should be, ( and why )
...............or injectors being pretty warn out ......
that could explain rich running.
I would not assume that just because the temp 2 sensor is new means it , or
it's wiring, shouldn't be considered. I'd at least test the ohms versus
temperature to make sure it's in the ballpark , or install the old one
temporarily.
I know it's very popular for people to 'fix things' with a new temp 2 sensor
......
and I rarely, rarely, ever find one actually bad. More like the connections
to it are the dodgey part.
a few of my thoughts, so far.
Scott
www.turbovans.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Amy Miner" <vanagonwestygirl@GMAIL.COM>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Wednesday, June 17, 2009 3:20 PM
Subject: Re: 87 2.1 loss power
>I checked the O2 centerwire and I get .5 volts. I checked the center to
> ground and its not grounded. When I touch the center of the wire to ground
> I
> don't see anything happen.
> The motor was warmed up and still no change. When I rev the motor I am
> getting black
> soot coming out the exhaust in small puffs. I have the throttle switch
> adjusted and checked
> with a meter to be operating correctly. The temp 2 is new and if I unplug
> while warming up the idle jumps up. If I unplug when fully warmed it
> stalls.
> This is a new rebuild and I don't want to damage anything before I solve
> this problem. What gets me is it happened suddenly
> while driving. Other than the temp2 and O2 sensor what would cause the
> motor
> to run Rich?
> I don't think its a cylinder not firing. I guess I could pull wires and
> see
> if I get any big change
> in running.
>
> ---
>
> On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 11:35 PM, Dennis Haynes
> <d23haynes57@hotmail.com>wrote:
>
>> You really don't want to advertise that you are knowingly and willingly
>> operating your van with the O2 sensor disconnected and the cat hollowed
>> out.
>>
>> My guess is that near the O2 sensor connector the coaxial wire is damaged
>> and the center wire is shorted to the outer ground sheath. Check the
>> connector with a voltmeter. With the ignition on you should see ~.5 volt.
>> If
>> not you either have short or the center wire is open from the ECU input
>> or
>> the ECU is bad.
>>
>> Easy test is to quickly turn the ignition off and back on while the
>> engine
>> is running. If you get 30 seconds or so of good operation after the
>> reset,
>> then you know you have an O2 sensor wiring problem.
>>
>> Dennis
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf
>> Of
>> Amy Miner
>> Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 10:45 PM
>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>> Subject: 87 2.1 loss power
>>
>> Hi,
>> On our way to the ferry terminal on Sunday from a weekend of camping we
>> started having problems. After driving about 20 minutes the van started
>> to
>> have no power and wanted to stall. We made it to the ferry and once at
>> the
>> other side of the sound,the van started. It still ran with no power and
>> black smoke. Was not overheating or hot.
>>
>> History:
>>
>> Rebuilt motor,new distributer,cap,rotor,wires,temp 2 sendor,pro cleaned
>> injectors,all new hoses,fuel lines ect......
>> Grounds were all cleaned and some replaced while motor was installed.
>> Has about 70 miles since rebuild was installed. The O2 sensor is
>> unplugged
>> and cat is hollowed out.
>> Made sure the oxygen sensor plug wasn't touching anything to ground it
>> out.
>> Looked over the engine and all
>> vacumn lines are intact. Boot between throttle body/afm appears intact.
>> I did check the o2 connector and when the black rubber cover is over the
>> connector is shows a light ground. There is no wires from the braid coax
>> touching the center connector. It appears tha the black rubber has become
>> conductive for some reason. I pulled the rubber cover back and taped the
>> connector for now. With the cover off the ground goes away. Checked the
>> wire
>> from the plug at the afm and shows no ground at all now.
>> I also checked the throttle switch and that needs to be adjusted. It
>> works
>> correctly full throttle but not at rest. The throttle butterfly show zero
>> ohms at rest and infinate at full
>> throttle. I will adjust that in the morning. Looking for some other
>> suggestions to look at tomorrow to help with trouble shooting my problem.
>> I also am curious that if anyonelse has replaced their coolant gauge
>> sendor
>> and now it shows normal temp at 3/4 of gauge? Mine used to rest right
>> around
>> the light in the middle. This is on a 87 and I am wondering if I should
>> try
>> the other type gauge sendor with the different connector that the later
>> years have to see if that will bring it back to where it used to be. I
>> had
>> to resplice the wires to this connector and wonder if I added resistance
>> to
>> the circuit. Does that light in the coolant gauge also start to flash
>> when
>> the coolant gets to hot? I know it flashes if there is low coolant.
>>
>> Thanks and look forward to any suggestions as I work through getting this
>> sorted out....
>>
>> A.
>>
>>
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