Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 15:59:22 -0400
Reply-To: Amy Miner <vanagonwestygirl@GMAIL.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Amy Miner <vanagonwestygirl@GMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: 87 2.1 loss power
In-Reply-To: <3140418f0906181258k3daf81abk8475e7879e97b0d6@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
I also forgot to add I"ll take it for a drive and try the 30 second test.
Doesn't seem to make a change while not underload in the driveway.
A.
On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 3:58 PM, Amy Miner <vanagonwestygirl@gmail.com>wrote:
> What concerns me is that when the motor is fully warmed up and I touch the
> center which had .5 volts on it to ground nothing changes. I did check the
> wire and there is no ground on it with a ohm meter. I checked to ground on
> the block and checked to the braid around the coax and there is no short to
> ground. The injectors have all been pro cleaned before I installed them. I
> tried to pull plug wires at idle and each one changes the way the motor runs
> very little. I have a fuel pressure gauge and I will check that tonight. At
> idle is appears to run okay but when I rev the motor I get puffs of black
> soot. Even leaves little black specs on the ground. I am just trying to
> figure out what would make the motor get "stuck" in what appears to be a
> cold running mode. Would to much fuel make the van lose power while driving?
> I also checked the oil and it still looks/smells clean. Doesn't appear to
> have fuel in it. I'll report back on the fuel pressure later,I'll check all
> grounds again,pull the plugs and look at them.
> Will look back here for more suggestions when I get home before I start
> working on it tonight
> so please keep the suggestions coming. I'd like to get this sorted out
> before my husband gets home from work this weekend.
>
> A.
>
> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 8:38 AM, Ken Wilford <kenwilfy@comcast.net>wrote:
>
>> Amy you are getting good advice here with Scott and Dennis helping you. I
>> would definitely suspect the oxygen sensor coaxial wire as my primary
>> suspect. You can buy some new wire at Radio Shack and re do this wire from
>> the ECU to be sure. As Denis says if you turn the van off and then back on
>> and it runs better for 30 seconds that is the key. If it does then it is a
>> sensor problem. If it doesn't then it is a hard part problem (fuel pressure
>> regulator, fuel injector leaking, etc). Let us know what you find out and
>> if I can be of help to you please let me know.
>>
>> Ken Wilford
>> John 3:16
>> www.vanagain.com
>>
>>
>>
>> Amy Miner wrote:
>>
>>> I checked the O2 centerwire and I get .5 volts. I checked the center to
>>> ground and its not grounded. When I touch the center of the wire to
>>> ground I
>>> don't see anything happen.
>>> The motor was warmed up and still no change. When I rev the motor I am
>>> getting black
>>> soot coming out the exhaust in small puffs. I have the throttle switch
>>> adjusted and checked
>>> with a meter to be operating correctly. The temp 2 is new and if I unplug
>>> while warming up the idle jumps up. If I unplug when fully warmed it
>>> stalls.
>>> This is a new rebuild and I don't want to damage anything before I solve
>>> this problem. What gets me is it happened suddenly
>>> while driving. Other than the temp2 and O2 sensor what would cause the
>>> motor
>>> to run Rich?
>>> I don't think its a cylinder not firing. I guess I could pull wires and
>>> see
>>> if I get any big change
>>> in running.
>>>
>>> ---
>>>
>>> On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 11:35 PM, Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@hotmail.com
>>> >wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> You really don't want to advertise that you are knowingly and willingly
>>>> operating your van with the O2 sensor disconnected and the cat hollowed
>>>> out.
>>>>
>>>> My guess is that near the O2 sensor connector the coaxial wire is
>>>> damaged
>>>> and the center wire is shorted to the outer ground sheath. Check the
>>>> connector with a voltmeter. With the ignition on you should see ~.5
>>>> volt.
>>>> If
>>>> not you either have short or the center wire is open from the ECU input
>>>> or
>>>> the ECU is bad.
>>>>
>>>> Easy test is to quickly turn the ignition off and back on while the
>>>> engine
>>>> is running. If you get 30 seconds or so of good operation after the
>>>> reset,
>>>> then you know you have an O2 sensor wiring problem.
>>>>
>>>> Dennis
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf
>>>> Of
>>>> Amy Miner
>>>> Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 10:45 PM
>>>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>>>> Subject: 87 2.1 loss power
>>>>
>>>> Hi,
>>>> On our way to the ferry terminal on Sunday from a weekend of camping we
>>>> started having problems. After driving about 20 minutes the van started
>>>> to
>>>> have no power and wanted to stall. We made it to the ferry and once at
>>>> the
>>>> other side of the sound,the van started. It still ran with no power and
>>>> black smoke. Was not overheating or hot.
>>>>
>>>> History:
>>>>
>>>> Rebuilt motor,new distributer,cap,rotor,wires,temp 2 sendor,pro cleaned
>>>> injectors,all new hoses,fuel lines ect......
>>>> Grounds were all cleaned and some replaced while motor was installed.
>>>> Has about 70 miles since rebuild was installed. The O2 sensor is
>>>> unplugged
>>>> and cat is hollowed out.
>>>> Made sure the oxygen sensor plug wasn't touching anything to ground it
>>>> out.
>>>> Looked over the engine and all
>>>> vacumn lines are intact. Boot between throttle body/afm appears intact.
>>>> I did check the o2 connector and when the black rubber cover is over
>>>> the
>>>> connector is shows a light ground. There is no wires from the braid coax
>>>> touching the center connector. It appears tha the black rubber has
>>>> become
>>>> conductive for some reason. I pulled the rubber cover back and taped the
>>>> connector for now. With the cover off the ground goes away. Checked the
>>>> wire
>>>> from the plug at the afm and shows no ground at all now.
>>>> I also checked the throttle switch and that needs to be adjusted. It
>>>> works
>>>> correctly full throttle but not at rest. The throttle butterfly show
>>>> zero
>>>> ohms at rest and infinate at full
>>>> throttle. I will adjust that in the morning. Looking for some other
>>>> suggestions to look at tomorrow to help with trouble shooting my
>>>> problem.
>>>> I also am curious that if anyonelse has replaced their coolant gauge
>>>> sendor
>>>> and now it shows normal temp at 3/4 of gauge? Mine used to rest right
>>>> around
>>>> the light in the middle. This is on a 87 and I am wondering if I should
>>>> try
>>>> the other type gauge sendor with the different connector that the later
>>>> years have to see if that will bring it back to where it used to be. I
>>>> had
>>>> to resplice the wires to this connector and wonder if I added resistance
>>>> to
>>>> the circuit. Does that light in the coolant gauge also start to flash
>>>> when
>>>> the coolant gets to hot? I know it flashes if there is low coolant.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks and look forward to any suggestions as I work through getting
>>>> this
>>>> sorted out....
>>>>
>>>> A.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
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