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Date:         Sun, 12 Jul 2009 17:07:51 -0400
Reply-To:     Kim Brennan <kimbrennan@MAC.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Kim Brennan <kimbrennan@MAC.COM>
Subject:      Re: Big brake conversion
In-Reply-To:  <BAY132-DS6A96AC2C7F99DBCA1608FA0250@phx.gbl>
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes

Speaking of brakes...

The GoldBrick (my 86 Syncro GL passenger Vanagon) had a brake master cylinder that had been leaking, and was definitely in need of replacement.

So I hunted up the info on the net BTDT (Been There. Done That.) from Joel Cort had a nice straight forward right up. Since I already had the replacement master cylinder I started in on the task last night.

Fairly straight forward. Except for the bleeding part. Since the GoldBrick's brakes hadn't been touched in a while I figure it was time to get change the fluid too.

I've SA Big Brakes on the front, but still have stock drums on the rear. I got a power bleeder, but the problem with these is that you suck in a lot of air from the bleeder itself, and not as much from the brake line. My right rear brake line also seemed to be somewhat clogged, but a good stomp on the brake pedal finally got the old crap out.

Sure is going to be nice having reliable brakes again. :)

On Jul 12, 2009, at 4:47 PM, Dennis Haynes wrote:

> I have to disagree a bit here. While some of this may be true for > extreme > conditions or panic stops weight distribution and other factors have > a lot > of influence. Most cars are front heavy and of course weight will > shift to > the front while stopping but the Vanagon has much more a of 50-50 > weight > bias particularly when loaded. The rear brakes can do a lot. Most > folks that > complain about Vanagon brakes have rear that are nor working > properly, the > wrong shoes, and drums that are worn oversized. VW mad things a bit > worse as > both he adjusters and cylinders are on the same end so much of the > shoe is > not contacting the drum. > > Want a low cost brake upgrade? Here's how: > > Rear brakes. Make sure the drums are in spec. Go to the dealer and > get the > shoes set, 251698531LX, List price now only $60.00. > Get the hardware kit there also 251698545, $29.10 list. Get a pair > of ATE > wheel cylinders. (Dealers is not a choice here). > Remove the lower shoe mounts and shim them out 2-3mm. Put it all > together. > Make sure the cables are properly adjusted. After they seat you will > be > surprised how much the brakes will improve. > > For the fronts, get the PBR metal master pads. After they seat you > will have > brakes. Be sure the rotors are also within spec. I recently pulled > off a set > machined under 10mm. > > Dennis > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On > Behalf Of > Don Hanson > Sent: Wednesday, July 08, 2009 1:11 PM > To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM > Subject: Re: Big brake conversion > > Just some general comments on upgrading brakes... > > Generally speaking, putting more stopping power on the rear wheels > is a > waste of time and money for most vehicles. The major portion of your > braking is done with the front...The 'harder' the stop, the more the > front > end braking load is...Period. > Your brakes are only effective as the traction of your > tires...stomp down > in a panic stop and the front of the van sinks, the rear rises. The > weight > transfers to the front wheels...Once your rear wheels are really > 'un-weighted' by this forward weight transfer, they have no traction > to > contribute to braking at all. All the brake pad force and disc size > in the > world won't stop you any quicker without any traction. If you put > big ole > six piston Brembos on the front of a van you can probably lock up > the rears > even with the meager stock brakes back there...So why bother with > *more* > braking power? A locked up wheel is not a matter of degree..bigger > won't > lock it any more... All you do by putting bigger brakes at the rear > is add > unsprung weight and spend some money that may have been better used > for ABS > or something. > Just my opinion, but supported by some research...If you want a > visual of > this 'front wheels do most of the braking' concept you should watch > some > Moto GP or road racing videos..Watch those guys going into a slow > section > with their back tires waving around above the pavement under hard > braking.. > Don Hanson > On Wed, Jul 8, 2009 at 6:20 AM, Max Wellhouse > <dimwittedmoose@cfu.net>wrote: > >> Mike and Crew: The statement that the Small Car Big Brake Kit has >> Chinese rotors and calipers is false according to the ebay "ask >> seller a question " response I got from Small Car a day or two >> ago. The person responding said all parts were German-made. >> >> Mike, can you check with the person that told you about the Chinese >> parts? Collectively, I think the List would like to find out the >> truth. >> >> I guess i have a hard time believing that he rear big brake kit is >> $200 more than the front kit due to the additional cost of a rear >> caliper set up for emergency brakes; that's like $100/side. There >> must be a good reason though. >> >> DM&FS >> >> IO At 11:30 PM 6/30/2009, Mike Miller wrote: >> >>> Yeah what I've put out for brakes, pads, bolts and machining will be > close >>> to $600 if not more. But I got Brembo disks and the kit comes with > Chinese >>> made disks that are not good, or at least that's what has been >>> reported > to >>> me. >>> >>> I'd drill the holes myself as was suggested but I think I'd be >>> lucky if >>> they >>> would go on the van if I did. >>> >>> Mike >>> >>> >>> On 6/30/09 7:16 PM, "Max Wellhouse" <dimwittedmoose@cfu.net> wrote: >>> >>>> FWIW I got a quote of $25 to get all 20 of my MB knock off alloy >>>> wheel holes reamed out from 12mm to 9/16" by a local tooling >>>> shop. You ARE talking about 4 holes getting drilled right? Maybe >>>> there's welding involved who knows? >>>> >>>> For the time you've put into chasing down the new audi parts etc, >>>> and >>>> the $130 for this trip to the machine shop, that $600 kit is >>>> sounding >>>> better and better. >>>> >>>> YMMV >>>> >>>> >>>> DM&FS >>>> >>>> At 07:42 PM 6/30/2009, Mike Miller wrote: >>>>> Vanners, >>>>> >>>>> I'm in the final stages of converting my '87 syncro to Audi G60 > brakes. >>>>> >>>>> Took the calipers to a machine shop to get the mounting holes >>> rebored to the >>>>> correct spacing. Guy says $130. >>>>> >>>>> This sound about right or am I missing something here? >>>>> >>>>> Mike >>>> >>> >>


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