Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 14:54:05 -0700
Reply-To: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Subject: Re: rear brake shims
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Hi.....
this is getting kinda crazy almost.
I say that becuse .........
sure, I can well imagine that there is a tiny bit to be gained by shimming
out the bottom of the shoes.......
BUT ........it's hard for me to get behind that, since I go years and years
and hardly wear down brake shoes.
It's 'cheating' ............but I'll just replace one shoe that's worn at
the top with one that's not so worn .........
that gets me OK for tens of thousands of miles.
that part is rivited into the backing plate I beleive.
I have have a dozen backing plates not on vanagons, most of them not rusted.
if anyone needs to buy a good used backing plate for vanagon rear brakes, I
can supply them with one or two or whatever.
my personal recomendation is .......
forget this shim stuff for now, just do a good solid clean brake job.
For example..........how mnay people think to put anti-seize compound on
those little spots on the backing plate that the shoes slide on ?
not everyone, I'm sure, because there was a time in my car reapir career
that I didn't know about that, so I imagine others might not know about that
either.
I highly recommend taking off the rear wheel mounting flange to do rear
brake work on a vanagon.
besides just facilitating the brake work ( about 5 times easier with out of
the way ) .....
it's good to know the flange is not stuck on the splined axle......or loose,
or rusted , or whatever.
It's good to know you have the tools and skills to get that part off to do
rear wheel bearings.
It is not good to let things be untouched for years and years.
It IS good to have things apart for inspection and service, and corrosion
prevention treatments.
another trick some may not know.....
those return springs on the shoes........those can be a bear. The trick is
to use the shoe itself as a lever on the springs.
you hook both ends of the spring, one on the shoe, one on the backing
plate........then lever the shoe into place. Very slick.
I'm sure everyone knows to do only one side at a time.
that's so you can look at the other side for reference.
NEVER mix up parts side to side !
especially that flat bar with the adjustment screw on it.
there is one part there that will fit either way .......one way is 'more
right' than the other way. The Bentley book barely illustrates which was is
correct.
- where there's a slot that engages ...........those parts will fit either
way. Only one way is right.
I often back off the parking brake cable adjustment , do the brake
work....then tighten the adjustment back as a last step.
also ............the initial adjustment......
turn the adjsutment thing......until the drum fits over.
then jerk on the parking brake a few times..........that seats the shoes
against the drum.
I mean jerk, as in yank, not just pull, not real hard either, but a little
yank affect. . Makes the shoes jump and settle against the drums. Then take
the drum back off,
get a couple of more clicks out of the adjuster, drum back, on, repeat, etc.
. I do one side at a time.
I put anti-seize compound on the end of the shoes where they touch the
bottom pivot and the wheel cyinder.
I put it under the hold-down coil springs, and on those slide points on the
backing plate.
I spray lube parking brake cables until they are nice and smooth.
I spray lube the pivot points of the parking brake handle, and the brake
pedal.
I actually find maybe 100 spots in a vangon where things pivot , latch, or
slide, that have never ever been lubed since the van left the factory.
Maybe way more than 100 even.
just do meticulous careful work.
always jack things up properly for good access.
Most of the time, it pays to undo something in the way for better access to
what you are working on.
In aricraft, it's called FOM ..........'facilitate other maintanence' .....
they send the radar guy out to remove the radar antannna so the hydrualic
guy can get at something behind it , etc.
So do FOM when it's appropiate. It pays to do nice solid clean work, and be
proud of your accomplishment.
Anybody ever heard of a 'cable shortenter' ?
its' a real thing you can get at a FLAPS .....or mabye in the past you
could. Havn't seen one for a while.
Shouldn't need one though, but they exist.
oh ! ......this shim thing ........I'm sure it's valid.
But it reminds me of my mantra or maxxim - 'New Part is only worth so much
in producing a good result, and really solid workmanship is worth about 90
% towards producing a good result.'
i.e. .......it's only partially in the parts used, the vast majority of a
good result comes from meticulous workmanship.
and there are a lot of ways to do drum brakes wrong.
as drum brakes go in the automotive world...........vanagon rear ones are
actually not bad at all. I totally approve of them actually, and I'm rather
critical of many poor design things I see on cars , but vanagon rear drum
brakes are all right. Just do good work on 'em. And it's 'all about the
Workmanship, NOT the parts !"
those count too of course,
but not as much as good workmanship.
do good work, have fun.
later !
Scott
www.turbovans.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Warren Lail" <wklail@GMAIL.COM>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Friday, July 31, 2009 1:07 PM
Subject: Re: rear brake shims
> Someone in an earlier post today said that they ruined the backing
> plate trying to remove the v-shaped thing with the notches. I have
> since deleted my digest and don't have the message. During my ordeal,
> I took the two bolts out but it looks like the device is held in by a
> pin of some sort. Does anyone know how correctly remove that thing?
>
> AND update on brakes. The rear brakes seem to be adding more to my
> stopping performance than before. Now instead of the full on "plunge"
> of the front end upon hard braking, I get more of an overall
> 'squatting' feeling, which tells me the rear brakes are contributing.
>
> Warren in Santa Fe
> 88 Westy, Subie 2.2