Date:         Fri, 28 Aug 2009 20:14:09 -0700
Reply-To:     Steve Williams <sbw@SBW.ORG>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Steve Williams <sbw@SBW.ORG>
Subject:      Re: Your GoWesty Engine...how do you like it?
In-Reply-To:  <405388.36178.qm@web83602.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed

At 08:59 AM 8/28/2009, RICHARD KOERNER wrote:
>SO...tell me about that engine!  Is it the 2.3?

Yep.

http://www.gowesty.com/ec_view_details.php?id=4073

>You must have previously had (like I do) the 1.9; how do you like the new one?

I like it a lot.  I can't compare it to fresh 1.9, because this is my
first Vanagon, and its engine was shot when I bought it.  It ran, but
it went up hills worse than my '82 diesel Rabbit.

Now it drives like any other car.  It goes up hills without
down-shifting and merges onto the freeway easily.  And it gets over
20mpg pretty consistently on the highway:

http://www.fuelly.com/driver/sbw/vanagon

One of the reasons I like the 2.3L engine: It's a straight
modification to the stock engine.  I know there are lots of
conversions out there that get great results.  But I think a
conversion is always going to be more complex, and I really value
simplicity.  If the waterboxer can be made to perform better, I'd
rather stick with that, at least until I know a lot more about Vanagons.

Even GoWesty's 2.3L mod introduces new complexity to
ownership.  That's what I like least about this engine: A 2.3L engine
using the stock fuel and air system has some special requirements,
and not all shops are going to deal with that well.

It's important to remember that they don't replace accessories or
systems that are working well.  For example, they keep the fuel and
induction system from your old engine, unless they're bad.  I've been
lucky so far, but see the LONG AFM story below.

Still, I think any other conversion would carry more complexity than
GoWesty's, so I'm happy with my decision.

>How much did it cost?

I paid the advertised price: $4,395 plus up to $1,000 core charge.  I
got back $854 of the core charge.

http://twitter.com/sbwsty/status/1937958899

Their minimum estimate for installation is around $1,500, but because
they re-use all serviceable items outside of the engine, the cost can
vary a lot.  I got a new starter, for example, but my clutch was
fine.  See below for more.

>Running higher octane like they recommend?

Yep.  In Iowa, all of the premium gas has corn in it.  Not sure what
to think about that.

>How does it perform on long grades?

I drove from Los Angeles to Utah shortly after the initial break-in,
and it was a real pleasure.  The grades were no problem at all.  (But
see below.)

>What other stuff did they "strongly recommend" with the new engine,
>and how much did all that cost?

GoWesty strongly recommends replacing as many of the cooling hoses as
possible.  I was on board with that.  In fact, that's partly why I
had them remove the rear heater: It's kinda stoopid to begin with,
and it's more hoses to fail.

Halfway through the engine installation, GoWesty called me and
strongly recommended installing an entire 2.1-style cooling
system.  They said some of the parts for the older system are
unavailable and so require adaptation, and the newer system is just
better.  I pushed back a bit to make sure they hadn't just gotten the
idea that I have a bottomless pocketbook.  In the end, I was
satisfied they believe it'll be more reliable and easier to maintain,
so I told them to go ahead.

I've had no problems at all with cooling.  The temperature needle is,
as far as I can tell, just a windshield washer for the little LED
that never comes on.  The needle just wipes back and forth across the
face of the LED, depending on whether the A/C compressor is running
or whether I'm going up a long grade.  I expect that'll continue for
a long time, and that's a great feeling.

The estimate for replacing the whole cooling system, parts and labor,
including radiator, but WITHOUT replacing front or rear heater core or the fan:

1.9L style: $1,728
2.1L style: $2,477

While the fuel tank was out for the cooling system upgrade, they
re-sealed it for about $400 parts and labor.

The muffler and cat were shot.  Parts and labor: $428.

The smog check got expensive, because the PO's smog check had failed
and triggered the "gross polluter" requirements.  The labor required
to get it to pass to those standards was about $160.

They did lots of other stuff, but I think that's everything engine-related.

Now, to expand a bit on "will it go up grades?"  Yes, it was a blast
to go up the grades from Los Angeles to Utah and beyond.  Some are
long grades.  Some are steep grades.  Some are some pretty long,
fairly steep grades.  With two people and all my full-timing gear
(and more) inside and in the dry bag on the roof, we went up all of
the grades on Interstate 15 more or less at the speed limit.

At first.

At some point, around southern Utah, it started losing power when I
opened the throttle beyond a certain point.  I got GoWesty on the
phone and cleaned up the AFM as much as I could, but the results were
inconsistent.  At various times, I was convinced it only happened in
rain, or at high altitude:

http://twitter.com/sbwsty/status/2110544429

I nursed the engine over the Continental Divide.  I don't remember
what was in my head that kept me from just stopping somewhere to have
somebody fix it.  I was able to drive the speed limit, but we lost
speed on the smallest grade, because I couldn't open the throttle
fully, or else the engine would LOSE power.

We got to Iowa City without too much trouble.  We were there a few
days, and I didn't notice the problem just driving around town.

We left Iowa for New York, but before Chicago, again in rain, it
started again.  I got on Autohaus and found Hollywood Motors in
Chicago.  We nursed the van in there, and they spent most of two days
working on it.

The first words out of the mouth of the boss at Hollywood Motors
were, "I think it's the fuel filter."  I would have been happy to try
that first, but I told them GoWesty had installed new filters.  (In
fact, I think GoWesty told me they modified the filter set-up to
include both filters, with the plastic one in front, or something.)

Because I told the Hollywood guys I had new fuel filters, and because
I was convinced it was the AFM, they checked the AFM per the service
manual and found that, yes, it was bad.  And they couldn't find a
source for an overhauled unit.

I called GoWesty and had an overhauled AFM shipped to Chicago
overnight.  The next day, Hollywood installed it, but they couldn't
get it to run right.  Why?  Because the service manual instructions
for a stock 1.9 simply don't work with a stock AFM installed on GoWesty's 2.3.

This is a good example of why everybody told me to look for an '86 or
later: If I understand correctly, the 2.1 can provide diagnostic data
to a shop with the right equipment.  That makes it easier to
maintain.  The 1.9 doesn't give the mechanic any data.

Hollywood worked with GoWesty by phone to get the AFM set up
correctly for the 2.3.  They finally got it all set up ...

And it still lost power when the throttle was opened.

At which point, the boss said, "I think it's the fuel
filter."  Hollywood was able to get both fuel filters locally.  They
put them on, taking care to catch the fuel from the old filters in jelly jars.

The plastic cubical fuel filter was full of dirt and junk and
horrible oily-looking gas.  (The metal cylindrical filter looked fairly clean.)

With the new fuel filters, the engine runs perfectly.

So, was the AFM bad?  I choose to believe that it was.  It tested
bad.  That's good enough for me.

Did the AFM contribute to the problem, or was it entirely the fuel
filters?  I don't know.  I think it might have been the fuel filters alone.

Why was the upstream fuel filter full of crap?  Perhaps my fuel tank
is full of crap. I don't know.  When GoWesty "re-seals" a fuel tank,
that doesn't include, like, steam cleaning it or scraping the old,
degraded sealant from the inside of the tank.  They just seal it from
the outside.

I now carry spare fuel filters.  If it happens again, I'll try that
first.  If the plastic fuel filter is full of crap again, I'll be
here asking where to get a new fuel tank.

Do I regret having an overhauled AFM on my overhauled, upgraded
engine?  Not one little bit.

I do, however, wish that GoWesty's modified engines came with an
addendum to the service manual, so I can hand it to mechanics I find
on Autohaus.  In General Aviation, we call that "Continuing
Airworthiness Information," and it's required for all modifications
by Federal Aviation Regulations.  I'd be willing to pay a little more
for such information on my engine.

But again, even with these caveats, I'm extremely happy with my GoWesty engine.