Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 12:56:00 -0700
Reply-To: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Subject: Re: waterboxer pinging
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="UTF-8"; reply-type=response
The octane requirement at higher altitude is less of course.
So in places like Colorado, their regular will be 85 Octane as you found.
So is the idea to use the least expensive fuel that will work,
or is it to use fuel that is adequate for this engine ?
there are many cars for which premium fuel is recommended, but they can run
fine on regular fuel. With 'smart' engine management systems, and knock
sensor ignition, the engine can still function well, but won't make as much
power quite, with the lower octane fuel. .
Point is..........there are cases where an engine can operate well, on
lower octane that is optimum.
I suspect this may not be the case with this GW engine, given that the
thread started with asking how to lower the compression ratio - in other
words, this engine is picky about fuel that goes into it. Yes ?
What does it do if you put in the very best high octane fuel you can buy ?
'normally' ...........you'd start with the best fuel, determine that works
well, then try to see how well it works as you use lower grades and quality
of fuel.......until you find the least expensive fuel that will work well
enough.
Perhaps that's the goal here actually.
Scott
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Mcneely" <mcneely4@COX.NET>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2009 12:11 PM
Subject: Re: waterboxer pinging
> the high altitude west. Starts in West Texas, western Oklahoma, goes on
> west from there until altitudes drop to around 2000 ft asl. Includes
> the great majority of that "mighty big place." When I was in Washington
> and Oregon this summer, I could not find alcohol-free gasoline. Same in
> Idaho and Montana. And everywhere I was above about 2000 ft. asl, the
> regular gasoline was 85 octane. That's been true for a good many years.
> I first became aware of it as a young man, and I'm a long way from that
> now. I've only driven in British Columbia and Alberta on a couple of
> occasions, both a long time ago, and I simply don't remember what the
> gasoline that I bought was. Since I was in coastal B.C., I imagine the
> fuel was 87 octane.
>
>
> On Thu, Sep 17, 2009 at 1:47 PM , Jake de Villiers wrote:
>
>> 'The West' is a mighty big place.
>>
>> In my sub-region of 'The West', from Alberta to British Columbia to
>> Washington and Oregon, regular gas is 87 Octane - alcohol is optional.
>>
>> Jake
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 17, 2009 at 11:17 AM, Dave Mcneely wrote:
>>
>>> Well, that sounds definitive. I was hoping for a reply that would
>>> enlighten me a little more, however. VW clearly recommends minimum
>>> octane 87. Gasoline in the West is clearly lower octane than that
>>> (on
>>> reasonable theoretical, and I suppose data driven, grounds).
>>> Numerous
>>> folks, including some with claimed technical expertise, state that
>>> the
>>> waterboxer is subject to detonation knock (ping) and that the octane
>>> value of the gasoline used is iffy in that regard. Consequently
>>> these
>>> folks recommend higher octane gasoline. If they are wrong, I'd like
>>> to
>>> know how we know that. If they are right, I definitely don't want to
>>> waste my money. I'd just like to understand it a little better. I
>>> certainly believe that pinging would be less noticeable in a vanagon
>>> than in a vehicle with the engine right in front of the driver. For
>>> driving in Oklahoma, I pay the extra for alcohol free gasoline. Is
>>> that
>>> a waste of money also? Actually, for my other cars, I concluded that
>>> I
>>> would pay up to but not more than $0.06 per gallon more. That was
>>> arbitrary. Given the alleged propensity of the waterboxer to be
>>> sensitive to gasoline quality (and VW's admonition in the manual to
>>> use
>>> alcohol free gasoline if possible), for that vehicle, I always pay
>>> whatever extra I have to to get alcohol free fuel, where it is
>>> available.
>>>
>>> Any explanation will be considered helpful.
>>>
>>> David McNeely
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Sep 17, 2009 at 12:18 PM , Richard A Jones wrote:
>>>
>>> And, am I just wasting my
>>>>> money, as most auto manufacturers state, when I pay extra for the
>>>>> higher
>>>>> octane stuff when out west?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes.
>>>>
>>>> Richard
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Jake
>>
>> 1984 Vanagon GL
>> 1986 Westy Weekender "Dixie"
>>
>> Crescent Beach, BC
>>
>> www.thebassspa.com
>> www.crescentbeachguitar.com
>> http://subyjake.googlepages.com/mydixiedarlin%27
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