Date: Wed, 30 Dec 2009 14:15:30 -0800
Reply-To: Don Hanson <dhanson928@GMAIL.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Don Hanson <dhanson928@GMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: Traction? Not very much
In-Reply-To: <965171C6-C6CC-4DD3-A147-7D039DC60722@comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Yes, I am in the Northwest. Wet snow. Slick. We usually head out south
for winter, but are late this season and I have been trying to avoid
licensing and insuring my 4x4 truck for just a 'few more days'.
But the vanagon is one of the worst snow vehicles I've driven....With very
agressive studded snow tires I would just maybe have a crappy snow vehicle,
it seems. With normal snow tires and all the other tricks I know about
snow...it just ain't very good at all. City streets and interstates, maybe
highways..yeah, ok, acceptable..but rural roads and driveways?...not cutting
it at all.
It's also not too easy to drive all crossed-up...nothing sticking out
front to see when you may be coming unstuck at the back end...
Oh well, a vanagon can't be perfect at everything...and having it not work
well on snow is a 'perfect' reason to go somewhere 'out of the snow'...
Don Hanson
On Wed, Dec 30, 2009 at 10:39 AM, Tom Buese <tombuese@comcast.net> wrote:
> Hmmmm?
>
> Shocks? Westy? More moisture in your snow than in Utah?
>
> Inquiring minds kneed to no?
>
> Tom-probably get stuck today w/ new snow falling?
>
>
>
> On Dec 30, 2009, at 11:20 AM, miguel pacheco wrote:
>
> Tom, that's funny, I have those Hakkas on my 2wd and you just say the
>> words 'snow and ice' and it starts spinning. We are here in Durango,
>> Co. where it is not as harsh a winter as Denver, but we do have
>> mo'hills. Chains are the way to go, completely transforming the
>> vehicle from a dangerous projectile. Wolf Creek Pass is no problem
>> with these modern, easy to install chains, that are available in these
>> modern times.
>> Miguel
>>
>> 'In heaven all the interesting people are missing.'
>> - Friedrich Nietzsche
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Dec 30, 2009 at 11:08 AM, Tom Buese <tombuese@comcast.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> FWIW, the best snow or M & S tires really do help & are a lot cheaper
>>> than the LSD? The difference between my old Michelin LTX M & S tires
>>> & my current Hakka CS M & S tires is like night & day. I too am an
>>> old
>>> time snow driver having lived in Steamboat Springs for 4 years,
>>> Denver
>>> for 3 more years, & Salt Lake City for 34 years.
>>>
>>> My 84 Westy used to be worthless w/ the Michelins even in the city &
>>> up at high altitude even worse. Now I can handle 10% grades covered
>>> w/ snow/ice almost as good as a real car! LOL
>>>
>>> I have never had to put chains on any of my VW buses over the
>>> years, &
>>> even tho I have a pair of chains for the westy, don't even carry
>>> them
>>> in the vehicle any more.
>>>
>>> I wonder if something else is the issue in your 84?
>>>
>>> YMMV,
>>>
>>> Mr. BZ
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Dec 30, 2009, at 10:46 AM, John Rodgers wrote:
>>>
>>> Dunno about Westy's, but the regular vans like my 88 GL are well
>>>> balanced over front and rear tires, and this doesn't exert much
>>>> force on
>>>> the rear tires. From all I have read, and taling a bit with Daryll
>>>> at AA
>>>> Ttansaxle - the only way to get it in a conventional drive Vanagon
>>>> is to
>>>> go to the posi-rear end. Should do the trick and be the very next
>>>> best
>>>> thing to 4X4 drive. Pricey, however - but maybe worth it.
>>>>
>>>> My $0.02
>>>>
>>>> John Rodgers
>>>> Clayartist and Moldmaker
>>>> 88'GL VW Bus Driver
>>>> Chelsea, AL
>>>> Http://www.moldhaus.com <http://www.moldhaus.com/>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Don Hanson wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> One of the few areas where I fault my 84 Vanagon manual tranny low-
>>>>> top
>>>>> 'westie' is it's lack of ability to go. I am now committed to
>>>>> 'saving up'
>>>>> for a limited slip diff.
>>>>>
>>>>> I am a very good snow driver. I lived over 20 years in Jackson
>>>>> Hole,
>>>>> Wyoming and drove to work at the ski area every day. My Ski Patrol
>>>>> job had
>>>>> me arriving there at an ungodly hour to shoot the avalanche
>>>>> control guns on
>>>>> stormy mornings, so my commute was often before any snow plows,
>>>>> through
>>>>> drifts white-out storms, etc. I had a variety of vehicles during
>>>>> those
>>>>> years, not one a 4wd and yet I rarely got stuck or couldn't make it
>>>>> where I
>>>>> needed to go.
>>>>>
>>>>> But this Vanagon really frustrates me. It's simply not good at
>>>>> all...in
>>>>> fact it is 'amazingly' poor. I keep trying, thinking "Hey, it
>>>>> can't be THAT
>>>>> bad, maybe if I_______ this time" and like that. It feels like it
>>>>> should do
>>>>> OK. I've been over all the suspension looking for reasons why it
>>>>> sucks..I
>>>>> have decent tires. The "open differential" must be waay more open
>>>>> than any
>>>>> other vehicle I have ever owned..Even my old long bed 2wd six
>>>>> cylinder ford
>>>>> pickup had better wintertime traction without any weight at all in
>>>>> the
>>>>> back...."Amazing"..
>>>>> Just yesterday I tried again to 'leave our Hill' in the Vanagon
>>>>> with a
>>>>> little snow (about 3-5") on our gravel driveway. Couldn't make it
>>>>> back
>>>>> up...missed by about 20' and had to go get the pickup to tow it up
>>>>> the rest
>>>>> of the way.
>>>>> Even with Nokian Hakka M+S with decent tread and a rear decklid
>>>>> loaded
>>>>> with ballast (480lbs of stove pellet bags) the van just would not
>>>>> make the
>>>>> grade...The van is virtually useless with any snow whatsoever. I
>>>>> had to
>>>>> 'un-mothball' my diesel Ford truck! I must be beyond the "Denial"
>>>>> stage
>>>>> finally.
>>>>>
>>>>> Don Hanson
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>
>>>
| 
