Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2010 14:23:55 -0800
Reply-To: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Subject: Re: Snow, 4wd vehicles and syncros
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="UTF-8"; reply-type=original
what !!!!
this is a criticism of the guy sharing that his syncro did just fabulously
driving in snow in town ??
I didn't see any indication of any unsafe driving in the guy's post.
and ....sure the Jag is more modern, and supposedly 'might' have more
capabilities in the slippery stuff than something older...
but ...
the syncro vanagon, all around .............the combination of AWD with
viscous coupling and locking rear differential , and good tires for snow and
ice...most amazingly , the syncro vanagon is what .....25 years old now if
you figure protypes running in 1985 and it 'just works' .
For what it is, without electronic controls even ....
it's fantastic. And a syncro SHOULD work well on packed snow even with less
than pure winter-dedicated tires on it.
And they are sort of 'self maintaining in terms of stability - for
example...
you can't power slide the back end out on turns because it's not real wheel
drive biased. So applying lots of power doesn't tend to put you sideways
like rear wheel drive will.
under braking, without electronic anti-lock brakes, the fact that the back
end and the front are linked mechanically provides a natural anti-lock
braking affect - you can't as easily lock up the front wheels under heavy
breaking, like you can in 2WD cars.
even at 25ish years age ....as an overall well working package, I don't
think the Syncro Vanagon has been topped yet really.
There might be this or that more modern that does this or that better ,
but overall......it's like a say .........Gibson Les Paul Guitar ...it's
just a famous classic that works well.
There are certain things that have yet to be surpassed. Jimi Hendirx has yet
to be surpassed. Same for the Beatles I say.
Same for the syncro Vanagon .....
as an over all package with it's capabilities ....it has not really be
surpassed, like completely brushed aside and made totally obsolete, by
anything yet.
Perhaps in Europe ....there's an AWD van with 'more' .....even still ....a
Vanagon syncro is an incredible not-crazy-electronics package that just
works well.
There might be this or that better this or that way, but as an overall,
package that you can work on it yourself, it's not too complicated and
expensive and crazy .............the Syncro Vanagon has .yet to be
surpassed. The Eurovan sure does not replace a vanagon, not when you count
about 15 factors, like ease of working on it ...and one of the Vanagon's
most brilliant yet simple features - good ground clearance .
they be damn good vehicles.
I do think syncro's 'like money' a bit. I'll always warn about that, but
...performance wise, even bone stock they are incredible.
personally, I love passing spun out SUV's in snow and storms, even with my
2WD. It's the other idiots you need to watch out for !
VROOOOOM !
Scott
www.turbovans.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Mcneely" <mcneely4@COX.NET>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Sunday, January 31, 2010 1:53 PM
Subject: Re: Snow, 4wd vehicles and syncros
So, 90 degree turn (a corner in other words) at 50km ph (slightly over 30
mph)? Well, you maybe, but I'm glad you don't drive in my neighborhood.
4WD exists to get you going, not to get you and others killed.
David Mc
---- David Marshall <mailinglist@FASTFORWARD.CA> wrote:
> Now, take a 90deg
> intersection at 50 km/h like you would in the dry only cover it in ice and
> then a layer of snow on top of that. Do it in a Syncro and then do
> it in a quattro. With the Syncro you will have the back end come out
> because those wheels are going to spin while the fronts do nothing other
> than get slowed down by the snow. One the rear wheels start spinning
> you will start to loose control. In effect you better be quick or
> else you will get into a horrible spin. With an all wheel drive like
> the Audi quattro it is always 50/50 front and rear so one end won't spin
> even for an instant faster than the other end. The older Torsen
> diffs would pull power away from the wheels that want to spin and the
> newer electronic systems do the same as well. The new Subarus are
> pretty good too!
>
> Not sayign the Symcro is bad, just that there
> are better much 4WD systems out there!
>
> David Marshall
> VW
> Adventure Driver and BMW Adventure Rider
>
> HasenWerk
> http://www.hasenwerk.ca
>
> On Sat, January 30, 2010 23:04, Kim
> Brennan wrote:
> > So the Washington DC area got the snow I
> predicted earlier in the week
> > (helps to have good weather
> models...and then to trust them.) About 6
> > inches in my immediate
> area (Tyson's Corner, VA, on DCs western side.)
> >
> > I had
> some errands to run and headed out in my Jaguar X-type (manual
> >
> transmission, all wheel drive.) I've got some Vredestein severe winter
> > rated tires on it (less than 3000 miles on them. Didn't really have
> any
> > trouble, but (as I had noted earlier with this vehicle) the
> majority of
> > the power goes to the rear, and in turns it is not
> difficult at all to
> > break the rear loose from the road. Mine is
> a 2002, which uses a Viscous
> > Coupler (later they went away from
> that.)
> >
> > I then stopped in at the house and changed
> vehicles to my 91 Syncro
> > passenger van (non-GL, with an SVX
> engine). This vehicle as the Nokian
> > tires
> >
> >
> Uh. Night and day. While the Jag is competent, the Vanagon Syncro is
> > otherworldly. Never had trouble, even in turns, same set of roads
> too.
> >
> > I love my Syncros. :)
> >
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